Deep Sand Beds for Freshwater tanks

['vspec']

I'm gonna be honest, I can't exactly understand what you're trying to say in that last paragraph. Gas is obviously lighter than water, but if a bubble of hydrogen sulfide was released in your tank it would be deadly

As ive been trying to point out, you cant look at it exclusively from that perspective, just because it crosses the threshold doesn't mean its 007 with a licence to kill.

Ok, so lets clear this up abit, cause without a test bed & a whole run down on known variables, we're essentially talking into the wind!

Can we agree that based on this particular stumbling block, thats its essentially boiling down to lethal dissolved concentrations by volume?

 

['vspec']

I read that article last winter and decided to give it a try on my 220; which has a pretty heavy bio-load. In May I built a new sump and filled it with 30-40lbs of sand, about 4" deep. I used 3m color quartz I had laying around. My sump is basically a 27g bin with the sand and a pump, no other media. Mechincal filtration happens in a settling chamber prior to entering the sump. For the first 3 months I had an FX5 running side by side. I recently removed the FX5 and started testing the water everyday. Ammonia and Nitrites stayed at 0. Because of other factors I can't speak on nitrate reduction at this time.

Get to back to some live examples, have you negated the other factors yet in order to give some results?.

Ok just so ive got this correct, this is a brand new first quarterly tank?
If so, if your willing, this can be the online benchmark for conversation

From my perspective, I found the freshwater environment stabilised within this time, whereas in marine, from an anaerobic prospective, it really hit its stride in the next quarter ( between 3-6months )

 

[knifegill]

Going to grab some sand nearby from a nice bed that houses a lot of worms and fingernail clams. I can spot grain size down to at least 1/2mm, so I'll be eyeballing it down to 0.2mm. If the thing is already housing such bios, it is probably suitable as a sand bed, right? I'll boil it before using it, trying not to rinse any away. Wish me luck.

 

[Dan F]

Going to grab some sand nearby from a nice bed that houses a lot of worms and fingernail clams. I can spot grain size down to at least 1/2mm, so I'll be eyeballing it down to 0.2mm. If the thing is already housing such bios, it is probably suitable as a sand bed, right? I'll boil it before using it, trying not to rinse any away. Wish me luck.

The thing I would worry about is that all that fauna is going to die when you boil the sand, so you will be starting out with a bunch of dead stuff. Why not try it on a tank with some feeders and don't boil it? Just a thought...

 

[knifegill]

No thanks. As much fun as that would be, how could anybody reproduce the results? I am going to introduce just a few common burrowers including malaysian trumpet snail and blackworm. Any other inhabitants recommended? I'll probably plant something leafy in it eventually, but for now I want the simplest set up for the most control. I don't have access to any great equipment, so the best I can do is monitor nitrAtes and take pictures.

I have ruled out boiling as our good stove burner exploded while I was boiling driftwood and my wife would hang me if I blew the other front burner boiling sand.

I am curing it out with tap water and stirring. My new question is, do I want all the suspended silt or should I pour it off?

 

[carsona246]

I dont see why it would hurt the actual filtration method, but it might be annoying to have it in there. I have the same concerns as Dan though. If you already have all the natural fauna living in there, why not let them stay to better utilyze the sandbed? Tell me how blackworms go, I was interested in cultivating them for food, and might just go get some to stick in my tank if you can successfully keep them alive.

 

[Tsc123]

I'm familiar with the saltwater concept of dsb, but from what I read the success of it depended on the existance of the micro organisms in the dsb. I think the problem with freshwater is you dont have those organism to stir up the sand and prevent anaerobic gas. What exactly would the point be for freshwater either? Like penguin said, theres really no reason as long as you utilyze plants your parameters will be much easier to keep in range. Since I've used plants in my tanks I havn't had any nitrates in my tanks, other than the nitrate I add. Not to mention 0 ammonia or nitrite

What about for those of us who have fish that don't allow us to keep plants...wouldn't this be another simple option, or do you know any other easier ways (besides water changes) to reduce nitrates?

 

[carsona246]

Honestly I think the best way to not have a nitrate problem is to not overstock your tanks. There are many types of plants that could work in a fish tank, such as floating plants that most fish would allow, however if you really wanted to explore the possibilities of dsb in freshwater I dont see anything stopping anyone. I was just saying I dont think theres a practical reason for it, or that it would be as effective without the availability of substrate sifting micro organisms that saltwater provides.

 

[Dark Jester]

What about for those of us who have fish that don't allow us to keep plants...wouldn't this be another simple option, or do you know any other easier ways (besides water changes) to reduce nitrates?

DSB and Plants are the only 2 things I am aware of that will remove NitrAtes from the water column, aside from water changes (or chemicals you shouldn't be relying on). Overstocked or not, they will build up unless you have one (or both) of those 2 methods in place to remove them.

 

[knifegill]

I'm not overstocked. I just want 0 nitrAtes. I'll still be doing weekly water changes.

Blackworms take almost no effort to breed. Give them their own little tank with about 1" of small gravel and feed them. They will eat anything, whether it decomposes and they eat the bacteria or they mob it and it dissolves before your eyes. They really like algae wafers, especially Hikari for some reason. Probably the corn and wheat causing better bacterial growth. I also give them broccoli leaves but I'm sure any pesticide-free raw green would work, too. Think infusoria.

They usually reproduce by dividing into two smaller worms rather than the egg method.

Temp about 75ºF seems to work well. Light filtration is all you need. They really go after green water, too, so I guess many types of "microbe" will do as food. You won't be producing scoops and scoops this way, but it will do for that weekly or biweekly feeding here and there. Bigger tank = more worms.

Edit: I've been raising blackworms for a long time. It's no work at all.

Check out the articles and threads about blackworms over at Aquaria Central. A member there is in love with the little guys and has written a book's worth about them.