Discussion of some ethical issues
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So are you implying that the government should regulate fish keeping, or do you think there should be an organization created to regulate fish keeping?
I ask because I'm pretty sure the government has far more important things to do, as well as starting an organization to regulate fish keeping would be about as accepted as PETA.
You bring up some interesting points, but how would these ever be enforced? It's sad that people buy animals that they can't take proper care of, but it happens all the time.
The only real thing we can hope to do is educate people on what they're actually buying, which is also hard.
I ask because I'm pretty sure the government has far more important things to do, as well as starting an organization to regulate fish keeping would be about as accepted as PETA.
You bring up some interesting points, but how would these ever be enforced? It's sad that people buy animals that they can't take proper care of, but it happens all the time.
The only real thing we can hope to do is educate people on what they're actually buying, which is also hard.
If it were a permit system for buyers, it would have to be a government organization or it would be totally ineffective. An accreditation system for sellers, like Justin Guest described, could conceivably be a voluntary private organization which offered certification to sellers of animals; informed buyers could choose to shop at accredited stores.
The idea is that the necessary bureaucracy and enforcement personnel would be paid for by the cost of the permits, much like fish and game agencies are supported by fishing and hunting license money. There would be an initial setup cost, but the system once started would be self-supporting.
I doubt a permit system will ever come into being, but as I said earlier, I think the only real alternative is widespread bans and other restrictions. There are too many costs to irresponsible animal husbandry, and pet hobbyists are not a sufficiently large or vocal group to resist 'feel-good' laws passed after snakeheads or piranhas show up in another river or another child is hurt by a big snake or dog. Things cannot continue forever as they are now, with loose rules and no oversight.
The idea is that the necessary bureaucracy and enforcement personnel would be paid for by the cost of the permits, much like fish and game agencies are supported by fishing and hunting license money. There would be an initial setup cost, but the system once started would be self-supporting.
I doubt a permit system will ever come into being, but as I said earlier, I think the only real alternative is widespread bans and other restrictions. There are too many costs to irresponsible animal husbandry, and pet hobbyists are not a sufficiently large or vocal group to resist 'feel-good' laws passed after snakeheads or piranhas show up in another river or another child is hurt by a big snake or dog. Things cannot continue forever as they are now, with loose rules and no oversight.
Regulating fish keepers won´t work. There will still be idiots out there who try to buck the system. Only education can have a long term positive effect. The german system is more based on educating first. For this reason the association I mentioned was started years ago by the industry. The government later recognised the association as providing an acceptable standard. As far as I know the BNA Association is still privately funded. Don´t get me wrong though, in my years of selling in Germany I still sent the odd customer packing. There will always be a few idiots in every society.Arthur;2768678; said:
I don´t think we should underestimate the effect of all the aquatic forums either. One forum alone may not do much but in the sum there will be quite a large effect. The BNA didn´t exist 30 years ago. Give the internet another 20 years and I think you´ll find a slow change occuring. I know a lot about fishkeeping but mfk alone has broadened my horizons considerably
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My .02 I am a believer in regulating large species fish reptiles etc... doesnt matter. Anything getting over 5-6 foot with scales is potentially hazardous. Get a permit its relatively inexpensive, compared to the food bill and resources provided daily for such large animals. And really all its gonna be is for someone to come over and make sure everything is fine with the animal and its conditions are met.
Some species that exceed a certain length/size dont even belong in the hobby. There are much better alternatives that may be a little more expensive initially, but are much cheaper in the long run and all at a fraction of the size of their larger counterparts.
Some species that exceed a certain length/size dont even belong in the hobby. There are much better alternatives that may be a little more expensive initially, but are much cheaper in the long run and all at a fraction of the size of their larger counterparts.
I am not in favor of banning most animals. Often there is a small minority of people who can keep them and I don't think they should have to not be able to because of some other irresponsible people or people who can't provide the conditions or what not.
My suggestion for fish to place all fish with special care needs on special order status. They should not be among the regular stock in the store as the store shouldn't have them unless someone orders one/some. Want a pacu for your 500 gal tank?..You go to the LFS and place a special order for one.
I feel this would eliminate most of the problems without making it too difficult for the right person to buy/adopt them. It would be fairly easy and the special order fish could be combined with the stores next fish order.
OK so people who wanted these fish would have to wait a week or two or however long it takes the shop to order new fish. It would be a small price to pay for keeping these animals out of the wrong hands.
I doubt most noobie fish-keepers couldn't be bothered with special orders and waiting a week or two for a fish. They'd want to walk in and buy a fish right now...which is partly why they end up with so many bad fish choices in the first place.
My suggestion for fish to place all fish with special care needs on special order status. They should not be among the regular stock in the store as the store shouldn't have them unless someone orders one/some. Want a pacu for your 500 gal tank?..You go to the LFS and place a special order for one.
I feel this would eliminate most of the problems without making it too difficult for the right person to buy/adopt them. It would be fairly easy and the special order fish could be combined with the stores next fish order.
OK so people who wanted these fish would have to wait a week or two or however long it takes the shop to order new fish. It would be a small price to pay for keeping these animals out of the wrong hands.
I doubt most noobie fish-keepers couldn't be bothered with special orders and waiting a week or two for a fish. They'd want to walk in and buy a fish right now...which is partly why they end up with so many bad fish choices in the first place.
