That totally sucks. We need a Erin Brockovich to get that city to pay the victims. Good luck on a remedy for the time being.
Don't you love roadblocks in the hobby?
- Thread starter ryansmith83
- Start date
Looking at the information that was presented by duanes, I feel a pre-treatment of the water using DE (if fine suspended particulates are present), peat and carbon would make the water safe. If Ph is an issue an HOB (aquaclear 110 or similar) with some crushed coral will adjust that, add some calcum and aid in degassing. A heavier dose of Prime should take care of any Clorene/Cloramines and heavy metals ie copper etc. Even without the DE this is IMO a viable and and cost efective way to achieve the desired results. This can all be done in a couple of large plastic containers. I hope some of this helps you save some of your stock. Good look with this situation Ryan, I hate to see a dedacated hobbiest like you go through this.
Below is a section from an artical on the benifites of peat filtration.
"Municipal wastewater often contains contaminants such as pathogens and harmful organic wastes. Left untreated, these effluents can have
extremely negative effects on the health of ecosystems, including serious illness from contaminated drinking water, loss of aquatic species, and damage to shellfish beds. Installing a peat filter water treatment system can protect against these problems by discharging water that is safe for living organisms such as fish and other aquatic life forms."
Below is a section from an artical on the benifites of peat filtration.
"Municipal wastewater often contains contaminants such as pathogens and harmful organic wastes. Left untreated, these effluents can have
extremely negative effects on the health of ecosystems, including serious illness from contaminated drinking water, loss of aquatic species, and damage to shellfish beds. Installing a peat filter water treatment system can protect against these problems by discharging water that is safe for living organisms such as fish and other aquatic life forms."
I agree with aquanero.
And for those who think water depts should provide water safe for fish, the trade off for humans is
dysentery, typhoid fever and many other waterbourne diseases.
As a water analyst I routinely tested my tank water for different species of bacteria, E. coli, and many other coliforms, Pseudomonas and plenty of others were constants, benign to fish, but at a minimum, if you drank them, you would spend days on the porcelain god.
And for those who think water depts should provide water safe for fish, the trade off for humans is
dysentery, typhoid fever and many other waterbourne diseases.
As a water analyst I routinely tested my tank water for different species of bacteria, E. coli, and many other coliforms, Pseudomonas and plenty of others were constants, benign to fish, but at a minimum, if you drank them, you would spend days on the porcelain god.
Really sorry to read about your situation, Ryan.
IMO that reads like an outdated water treatment facility. With today's technology there is absolutely no reason why ones tap water should be looking like monkey piss when it comes out of your faucet, at least not on a constant year round basis.
Water main breaks don't occur on a daily basis, and neither does the surge of extra disinfectant brought on from that type of situation. I live a few degrees north of most people here, and in the winter months our water leaves the faucet at approx 50F, and is always saturated with gas. Yet I have never experienced, seen, read, or even heard a whisper about anyone's fish dieing from gas bubble embolism. Can it happen, yes, but only under extreme situations (supersaturation) and has nothing to do with the OP's problem.
There is no excuse why ones tap water can't be safe for both humans, and fish. I live in a small city of less than 100K, yet our water quality is constant year round. Even during spring run off and/or periods of heavy rain we never experience massive surges in disinfectant, nor does the water ever look like what Ryan is experiencing.
Ryan - aside from the other advice that has been given, try to get hold of the supervisor/manager of your local water treatment facility, and see if he/she can elaborate as to why you are experiencing constant discolored water from your tap. Once you get him talking about anti-corrosive agents, or whatever is taking place, ease into your fish situation. If nothing else they might be able to explain what may be affecting your fish, which might help you come up with a workaround for the future.
Again, really sorry to hear about your fish.
IMO that reads like an outdated water treatment facility. With today's technology there is absolutely no reason why ones tap water should be looking like monkey piss when it comes out of your faucet, at least not on a constant year round basis.
Water main breaks don't occur on a daily basis, and neither does the surge of extra disinfectant brought on from that type of situation. I live a few degrees north of most people here, and in the winter months our water leaves the faucet at approx 50F, and is always saturated with gas. Yet I have never experienced, seen, read, or even heard a whisper about anyone's fish dieing from gas bubble embolism. Can it happen, yes, but only under extreme situations (supersaturation) and has nothing to do with the OP's problem.
There is no excuse why ones tap water can't be safe for both humans, and fish. I live in a small city of less than 100K, yet our water quality is constant year round. Even during spring run off and/or periods of heavy rain we never experience massive surges in disinfectant, nor does the water ever look like what Ryan is experiencing.
Ryan - aside from the other advice that has been given, try to get hold of the supervisor/manager of your local water treatment facility, and see if he/she can elaborate as to why you are experiencing constant discolored water from your tap. Once you get him talking about anti-corrosive agents, or whatever is taking place, ease into your fish situation. If nothing else they might be able to explain what may be affecting your fish, which might help you come up with a workaround for the future.
Again, really sorry to hear about your fish.
The only heavy metals that Prime will bind/precipitate, are those levels that are typically found in most local municipalities. (as in the ppb range) It will not remove, detoxify, or bind any heavy metals found in higher ranges.
I contacted Dr. Greg Morin at Seachem about this issue years ago, when at that time Seachem had removed the removal of heavy metal portion from their labels of Prime.
Below is my question, and Greg Morins response.
Question: Has the regular Prime formula changed, if not, why is their no longer any mention of Prime being able to detoxify heavy metals?
Answer:
One of the easiest solutions to reducing heavy metal toxicity to aquarium fish is upping the calcium carbonate levels in ones tank water. (crushed oyster shell, crushed coral, etc)
Accumulation of Heavy Metals in Freshwater Fish-An Assessment of Toxic Interactions with Calcium
http://scialert.net/fulltext/?doi=ajft.2006.139.148&org=10
Crushed oyster shell is sold as chicken grit at most farm supply stores, is dirt cheap, and is far more effective at reducing the uptake of most heavy metals by fish, than Prime.
HTH
One other thought that has happened to me:
Are the fire hydrants in your area "live" (valve on hydrant itself) or "dead" (valve in concrete next to hydrant)? In my area, we have alternating live and dead hydrants, the live are painted green on top, dead are yellow on top. every 4-6 months, the Fire Dept. has to come through and flush/purge all the dead hydrants. Every time this happens, I notice my sediment traps on my faucets start to clog up. Also had a master plumber in the area who's friends with my wife explain this one to me. Apparently it stirs up all the crap sitting in the street mains and can screw with average quality for a day or two depending on neighborhood usage. He also pointed out that many people use those dead hydrants to fill pools, with the same effect.
Are the fire hydrants in your area "live" (valve on hydrant itself) or "dead" (valve in concrete next to hydrant)? In my area, we have alternating live and dead hydrants, the live are painted green on top, dead are yellow on top. every 4-6 months, the Fire Dept. has to come through and flush/purge all the dead hydrants. Every time this happens, I notice my sediment traps on my faucets start to clog up. Also had a master plumber in the area who's friends with my wife explain this one to me. Apparently it stirs up all the crap sitting in the street mains and can screw with average quality for a day or two depending on neighborhood usage. He also pointed out that many people use those dead hydrants to fill pools, with the same effect.
While it's true that flushing a fire hydrant can cause sediments to get stirred up, which can cause (yellow/brown) discoloration in ones tap water, that is not something that takes days/weeks or months to clear up. Typically the water will clear up in less than 24 hrs. We just had a fire hydrant purged on our street last week, and 48 hrs later I was back to performing water changes with no issues.
Part of the problem is that fish as a whole do not all react the same, to the same environmental stress. Ryan just experienced this first hand. Some species are more sensitive to certain water parameters, than others. Even the size of the fish species can make a big difference as to their survival rate when exposed to stress from toxins etc. While a large ammonia spike may wipe out a number of fish in ones tank, others survive and go on living for years. Anyone that has ever cycled a tank with live fish has experienced this first hand. Some fish make it through the initial ammonia spike, others die, some die later when nitrites spike, while some make it through the entire ordeal. While one can increase the survival rate by utilizing things as simple as an elevated level of Vitamin C in the fishes diet (prior to the stress) even that may not be nearly enough for some individual fish, and/or some species, depending on the type and level of stress that they are exposed to.
Part of the problem is that fish as a whole do not all react the same, to the same environmental stress. Ryan just experienced this first hand. Some species are more sensitive to certain water parameters, than others. Even the size of the fish species can make a big difference as to their survival rate when exposed to stress from toxins etc. While a large ammonia spike may wipe out a number of fish in ones tank, others survive and go on living for years. Anyone that has ever cycled a tank with live fish has experienced this first hand. Some fish make it through the initial ammonia spike, others die, some die later when nitrites spike, while some make it through the entire ordeal. While one can increase the survival rate by utilizing things as simple as an elevated level of Vitamin C in the fishes diet (prior to the stress) even that may not be nearly enough for some individual fish, and/or some species, depending on the type and level of stress that they are exposed to.
Maybe this could help:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+20024+4484&pcatid=4484
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+20024+4484&pcatid=4484
@ RD, duanes & Aquanero, thanks for taking time to share info. who knows, any of us might need it someday.
Ryan, this sucks! You've got a great collection of cichlids and it pains me to think about you losing them.
I hope you figure out whats going on and can come up with a viable solution.
Good luck.
I hope you figure out whats going on and can come up with a viable solution.
Good luck.
