well they have been digging pits, but my WC disturb them so maybe thats the problem. i will try going a couple weeks and see if they start breeding and holding. i have seen some shimmy by some of the males, but i have had flukes in the tank in the past, so i thought maybe it was the flukes. Since i haven't seen any fry, i didnt suspect much. I guess i really thought they were too small to breed yet to. i will start giving them the chance and keep you updated. thx for the tips