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    Fill and Drain Faster 220 Gallon

    Discussion in 'Setup and Filtration' started by mike37909, Oct 10, 2018.

    1. mike37909

      mike37909 MFK Members

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      All,
      I am wanting to speed up the water changes. I switched to sand instead of gravel and got some circulation pumps and I don't vacuum the sand near as much anymore. I want to be more consistent doing water changes since I don't have to take off all the glass tops etc and vacuum.
      Takes 45 minutes to fill from kitchen sink using garden hose. Hose is too long so yeah I can try a shorter one. Also looked at cutting into my pipes in garage they are 1/2 inch copper but then I need a mixing valve for temp control. The idea was i would plumb in a large diameter hose and fill faster.
      Also thought about adding water barrels in the garage with float switches and using a big pump to refill. Then I would need to heat this water and would get too hot in summer....
      I drain out the window and I used garden hose and python so it went pretty quick.
      I have read about the drip systems but I don't want to flood on my hardwood and also do not have easy access to drain or fill lines in the living room.
      Right now I am leaning toward just putting the biggest diameter and shortest hose on the kitchen sink and see if I can get it to fill faster. From those who have been through this what do you suggest?

      Mike
       
    2. PYRU

      PYRU MFK Members

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      Well this is going to be tedious if you not willing to run a drain line.

      My recommendation. Run tees off hot/cold washer line. Add valves like a hose spigot so you can manually adjust then run a y connection fitting. Run some kind of approved hose to your tank. Manually adjust temp and add prime manually

      For taking water out. Go on ebay find a submersible pump 500-1k gph. Use adapters to connect the previously mentioned hose to your sub pump.

      An auto water change or drip would be way easier if you can make it work you aesthetically
       
    3. mike37909

      mike37909 MFK Members

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      Thanks for the reply. I like your idea and I may go with it.
      I have considered the drip system I would have to run a pipe or hose and bury it outside. Also penetrate through the wall. Is there a clean way to run lines through the wall? I am concerned with freezing of the pipe also.

      My tank is up against an exterior wall and house is on a slab of concrete.
       
    4. Drstrangelove

      Drstrangelove MFK Members

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      https://www.thespruce.com/determine-your-homes-gpm-rating-1821105

      Average (standard, residential) internal kitchen faucet water flow rates (gpm) vary around 2 gpm, so yes, replacing 100 gallons in a 220 could take 45 minutes. When I had multiple tanks running, they were several hundred gallons and the time was similar.

      External faucets might be 50-300% faster. Laundry room faucets (ime, as I had the old style double sink types), are faster than kitchen and bathroom sink faucets. Distance should have little effect on the speed unless the tank is located higher than the faucet (excluding the friction of the water in the hose.)

      Whether or not cutting into a water pipe "upstream" (no pun intended) will give you a higher rate or violate codes is something a plumber can help with, so I'd use a professional to be sure that you aren't cutting into the wrong place in the line or creating a health safety hazard. (I'm not a plumber, so don't quote me on this.)

      Other options might be reducing stocking so you can do smaller WC (less water) or staging (pumping and storing water in advance as you suggested.)

      Heating in the summer should not be a problem for staged water, since if it comes out at ~55F, it will gradually warm up in any garage warmer than 55F and be ready to go into a tank in a day or two. Overheating 55 gallons to let's say 90F in the summer seems unlikely in a couple days, but regardless, is easily cured by mixing in 20 gallons of cold water from the tap. Heating cold water in the winter however would seem to have a few more complications, but should be fine if you have a standard sized water heater.
       
      #4 Drstrangelove, Oct 10, 2018
      Last edited: Oct 10, 2018
    5. mike37909

      mike37909 MFK Members

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      My laundry is on the second floor and other end of the house i may try it though. I think i will measure flow rate with 5 gallon bucket in kitchen vs outside and laundry. I never thought about codes or health risks good point. I am going to try a bigger shorter hose and if it is still slow I may do a drip system. Better for the fish anyway so why not.
       
    6. Tarsun

      Tarsun MFK Members

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      i have been thinking about this for awhile now. Laundry room is behind the perpendicular wall that the tank is against.
      was thinking of cutting a 2in hole in floor to plumb in washer feed and have a drain line tap into laundry drain line.
      this would all be in the basement, so you would not be able to see any piping.
      the hole in the floor would be under the tank, so that would not be visible either.
      id use a hole saw and save the plug to repair in the future if needed...
       
    7. mike37909

      mike37909 MFK Members

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      Well I verified 2.5 gal a minute from kitchen sink. It has no aerator because I took it off to attach garden hose fitting. 2 minutes to fill 5 gallon home depot bucket. Still thinking on this.
       
    8. duanes

      duanes MFK Members

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      I had 3 banks of tanks totaling about 1000 gallons.
      So I ran a couple semi permanent PVC lines out windows which send old water to the garden from a each @ 300 gallons of tanks on a sump. When I wanted to do a water change, open the window, thread the line on the PVC outside, and close a valve, instead of water to the sump, its sent outside to the garden. Same for inside, PVC comes from a basement laundry, thru a 1/2" hole in the floor straight to sumps.
      [​IMG]
      [​IMG]
      Saves a lot of time on WC's, and waters the garden at the same time using water twice (at least in summer). In winter was was sent to laundry tubs in the baesment.
       
      fishhead0103666 likes this.
    9. narayanang76

      narayanang76 MFK Members

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      I have a 220g and I do 40% WC weekly. I have sand bottom but I don't vacuum the sand, my wavemaker keeps debris out of my sand. So it's just drain water and backfill, I use python from kitchen sinc for both. Takes less than an hour sometime 50 minutes for completing.

      I find that the preparation and wrapping activity is adding more time to the WC activity. Taking the hose, connecting it, then folding it and cleaning etc.

      I thought about following options for this.
      Have a permanent line set up for drain, and ideally get the tank bottom drilled with a ball valve. With this draining will just be opening of the valve. However many will have concerns on drilling @ bottom of tank. Similarly, have a permanent separate line for inlet, with this backfilling will also be easy. Backfill will depend on the turnover of the waterline completely.

      I have seen this setup in one of my friends, he does discus breeding. Due to the water quality requirements he needs to do WC daily across multiple tanks.

      In case the treated new water is stored in barrels, then a large hose connected to a high volume pump can be an option to drain the tank and also backfill. First keep the pump inithe tank for draining, then move the pump to barrel once draining is over.
       
    10. TheWolfman

      TheWolfman MFK Members

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      I made a thread on here a while back showing how I maintain my 220. Draining the tank is the easy part. You can only refill as fast as your tap alows, 1/2 copper only flows so much. But I find refilling from the tap to be way easier then trying to store and maintain a temperature in a holding container then pump it into the display tank.

      https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/did-someone-say-water-change.702000/
       

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