Filtration for large freshwater tank (120x36x24) ?

[jake37]

For this tank i will initially run co2. Once everything is large and grown in i might turn it off. The thing I dislike with co2 is that the sword plants get too large as well as the java fern (which is that front right corner mess in the picture I posted). But the anubias grow really well with co2. I hope to run this tank 20 to 30 years so over time things might change.
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For fast water changes - i will have a hole in the back middle with a pipe that goes to a drain so i can quickly drain 50% of the tank so backflush feature isn't that helpful - of course with it i wouldn't need a hole in the middle back BUT i would need other holes for the filter.

Do you plan on running C02?

 

[robmcd]

For this tank i will initially run co2. Once everything is large and grown in i might turn it off. The thing I dislike with co2 is that the sword plants get too large as well as the java fern (which is that front right corner mess in the picture I posted). But the anubias grow really well with co2. I hope to run this tank 20 to 30 years so over time things might change.
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For fast water changes - i will have a hole in the back middle with a pipe that goes to a drain so i can quickly drain 50% of the tank so backflush feature isn't that helpful - of course with it i wouldn't need a hole in the middle back BUT i would need other holes for the filter.

If it were myself I would run the 'close' system. I frequent some planted tank forums and all I seem to read from the people who keep the bigger tanks is the hassle of sumps and C02 distribution. I have seen pond filters that are just basically giant canister filters, combine an inline diffuser/reactor and you would be golden.

I really like the look of your 120. I prefer a natural look as opposed to Iwagumi or Dutch styles. I have a 2x4 120 gal that I am planning to go high tech with. Please post your build here. It sounds killer!!

 

[jake37]

Post the build of my 120? It is nothing exciting - just an off the shelf 2x4 120 with a couple of canister filters. I have to think about this I think you over simplified the head-ache of a close system. For one thing I had an inline diffuser on my 120 and it didn't work out that well so after a year i moved it to an in tank diffuser. There were two issues one the spray bar being at the top of the tank cause a lot of the co2 to be immediately lost (i think it works better having the diffuser at the bottom of the tank) and it got in the way when cleaning the filter.
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Anyway if you have a reference to one of these heavily planted tanks build i'll take a look. I really like the idea of no filter and just using the corner matten but a part of me is concern that will not be sufficient. Also i'd need some really strong power head to make current. If i put holes in the tank the current would be a bit easier and i wouldn't need power heads. With the 120 i don't need power heads the fx6 generates enough current.

I really like the look of your 120. I prefer a natural look as opposed to Iwagumi or Dutch styles. I have a 2x4 120 gal that I am planning to go high tech with. Please post your build here. It sounds killer!!

 

[nzafi]

Post the build of my 120? It is nothing exciting - just an off the shelf 2x4 120 with a couple of canister filters. I have to think about this I think you over simplified the head-ache of a close system. For one thing I had an inline diffuser on my 120 and it didn't work out that well so after a year i moved it to an in tank diffuser. There were two issues one the spray bar being at the top of the tank cause a lot of the co2 to be immediately lost (i think it works better having the diffuser at the bottom of the tank) and it got in the way when cleaning the filter.
-
Anyway if you have a reference to one of these heavily planted tanks build i'll take a look. I really like the idea of no filter and just using the corner matten but a part of me is concern that will not be sufficient. Also i'd need some really strong power head to make current. If i put holes in the tank the current would be a bit easier and i wouldn't need power heads. With the 120 i don't need power heads the fx6 generates enough current.

I am running two corner matten filters on my 535. I don't remember their exact dimensions, but they have enough surface area to support up to 150lbs of fish. Obviously you have to consider how many fish, size, how much you feed, etc but I can guarantee you that two HMF filters will easily support your stock. The challenge comes when you dealing with large fish or something like stingrays, then they will obviously clog faster. Also, as I mentioned when doing HMF you are using poret of certain PPI which you cannot go too small otherwise it clogs too quickly. This hampers your ability to do polishing that some people want. Frankly, I don't care about that.

 

[jake37]

Thanks. My 29s with HMF are more than clear enough for my liking. They are as clear as my 120 with the fx6. I think my only concern with the hmf is i would kind of prefer not to obstruct the left corner since that is my primary viewing window (the tank is next to my desk so when I'm suppose to work i watch the fishes like this):

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The opposite end of the tank i could care less about but i suspect i would need both corners covered and I would want the cross current. I guess the only real disadvantage is the lost space in the tank. Hum. So many trade offs - but minor. Kind of like the idea of not drilling the tank with regards to fault tolerance.

I am running two corner matten filters on my 535. I don't remember their exact dimensions, but they have enough surface area to support up to 150lbs of fish. Obviously you have to consider how many fish, size, how much you feed, etc but I can guarantee you that two HMF filters will easily support your stock. The challenge comes when you dealing with large fish or something like stingrays, then they will obviously clog faster. Also, as I mentioned when doing HMF you are using poret of certain PPI which you cannot go too small otherwise it clogs too quickly. This hampers your ability to do polishing that some people want. Frankly, I don't care about that.

 

[nzafi]

Are you having this tank custom built? I had mine custom built and acrylics bars inserted where I wanted. You can always do a half circle in the middle of the tank.

 

[jake37]

Yes it will be custom built. Undecided where - mostly likely customaquariums but i'm not sure which place is reliable and has decent prices. I saw that yours was an FD tank but I do not like acrylic - glass only person.
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Your talking about a half circle HFM? I might do that - i kind of like the corner but since I want to keep the corner next to my desk clear doing the half circle in the middle might be better. I'll check what swisstropical recommends. I'm still considering if i want to drill in the tank for circulation - but I also agree that drilling in the bottom is one more thing that can go horribly wrong - but that means more hardware that has to be mounted on the tank (power head or wavemaker).

Are you having this tank custom built? I had mine custom built and acrylics bars inserted where I wanted. You can always do a half circle in the middle of the tank.

 

[nzafi]

Yes it will be custom built. Undecided where - mostly likely customaquariums but i'm not sure which place is reliable and has decent prices. I saw that yours was an FD tank but I do not like acrylic - glass only person.
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Your talking about a half circle HFM? I might do that - i kind of like the corner but since I want to keep the corner next to my desk clear doing the half circle in the middle might be better. I'll check what swisstropical recommends. I'm still considering if i want to drill in the tank for circulation - but I also agree that drilling in the bottom is one more thing that can go horribly wrong - but that means more hardware that has to be mounted on the tank (power head or wavemaker).

You will see on swisstropicals they talk about quarter circles or half circles. It is really simple. You need to make sure you have enough sponge for your bioload. Stefan recommends less that what you see on the various HMF german websites. For me, my corner HMF came out only 9inches instead of much longer. I prefer corners because it lets direct flow to the center. Your proposed length of 12ft is definitely took long. In my experience, you don't want to extend beyond 4ft which means you will need powerheads on both sides pushing water to the HMF in the middle.

 

[jake37]

Yea. I will order the sponge from swisstropical. I've used his stuff in the past and I like his service. The tank is 11 ft not 12 but point taken. I'm still debating drilling below the tank - two holes for circulation but not sure.... It would take some pretty strong power heads the associated issues with them to generate good current.

You will see on swisstropicals they talk about quarter circles or half circles. It is really simple. You need to make sure you have enough sponge for your bioload. Stefan recommends less that what you see on the various HMF german websites. For me, my corner HMF came out only 9inches instead of much longer. I prefer corners because it lets direct flow to the center. Your proposed length of 12ft is definitely took long. In my experience, you don't want to extend beyond 4ft which means you will need powerheads on both sides pushing water to the HMF in the middle.

 

[nzafi]

Yea. I will order the sponge from swisstropical. I've used his stuff in the past and I like his service. The tank is 11 ft not 12 but point taken. I'm still debating drilling below the tank - two holes for circulation but not sure.... It would take some pretty strong power heads the associated issues with them to generate good current.

If you are talking about running the sponges, you can use multiple airlifts and easily run them fire a good airpump. I chose to use submersible pumps, but you need to make sure they fit.

For water movement, I will probably get something like a maxspect gyre. They push some serious water and do it in a fashion that will circulate the water better than traditional pumps.

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