Gar

[Polypterus]

^exactly. they get thier gators much larger than 1"

Not all the time... But then I guess that depends on the facilities focus...

 

[mqktandy]

The aquarium near me has 5ft gator gar almost as round as basketballs, and they said that they got them at 4ft wild caught. I'm betting most aquariums get them at a large size from the wild

 

[screaminleeman]

I hope that this is not true in my case. I will be MAJOR LEAGUE p'ed off if my LNG (Logan) that I currently have in my Deck GarDen pond, and have slated for spring fed my farm pond this spring does not reach 6' long! I don't have my spreadsheet handy to be able to give the exact date of the purchase of Logan from one of the LFS, but I can assure you that I am still a relative newbie to keeping fish (in aquaria), and that Logan is still under two years old. I got EVERY GAR that I own at tiny baby (1" - 2" range) and raised them to their current size. (I have had MANY, MANY failures with Gar in my very short trip in fishkeeping.

With that said, Logan has gone from under 2" to well over 2' in under 2 years. OMG, Solomon, you are indeed the trusted expert and this has just caused severe depression. If you are correct, and Logan does not quickly reach at least 3' by spring, I can see no possible chance of survival whatsoever in my pond!

How is it possible to keep Gar in an outdoor pond if this is true? I have two resident blue herons (They are territorial to the extreme leaving less then ZERO chance that they are NOT a mated pair) from early spring through late fall. They do not hesitate to snatch pond comets that are larger then NFL footballs as quick snacks.

How do you guys keep local birds from eating your shrimp sized Gar in your outdoor ponds? I can NOT place a mesh netting over the entire spring fed pond like I have protecting them in my deck GarDen pond, it is well over 100' in diameter!

 

[Wiggles92]

I hope that this is not true in my case. I will be MAJOR LEAGUE p'ed off if my LNG (Logan) that I currently have in my Deck GarDen pond, and have slated for spring fed my farm pond this spring does not reach 6' long! I don't have my spreadsheet handy to be able to give the exact date of the purchase of Logan from one of the LFS, but I can assure you that I am still a relative newbie to keeping fish (in aquaria), and that Logan is still under two years old. I got EVERY GAR that I own at tiny baby (1" - 2" range) and raised them to their current size. (I have had MANY, MANY failures with Gar in my very short trip in fishkeeping.

With that said, Logan has gone from under 2" to well over 2' in under 2 years. OMG, Solomon, you are indeed the trusted expert and this has just caused severe depression. If you are correct, and Logan does not quickly reach at least 3' by spring, I can see no possible chance of survival whatsoever in my pond!

How is it possible to keep Gar in an outdoor pond if this is true? I have two resident blue herons (They are territorial to the extreme leaving less then ZERO chance that they are NOT a mated pair) from early spring through late fall. They do not hesitate to snatch pond comets that are larger then NFL footballs as quick snacks.

How do you guys keep local birds from eating your shrimp sized Gar in your outdoor ponds? I can NOT place a mesh netting over the entire spring fed pond like I have protecting them in my deck GarDen pond, it is well over 100' in diameter!

Longnose gars don't really have the capacity to reach 6' in a short period of time. They grow fast for their first few years then growth slows down drastically.

Ponds are way different then aquariums. If you leave the gar in the pond year-round then it's going to stop growing for the winter, then it will start to rapidly grow again once spring comes back around. Rushing a gar to the minimum size needed for reproduction will only make for a smaller gar in the long run since it's going to be putting energy into growing its reproductive organs rather than overall body size.

For example, my two longnose gars went from around 2" when I got them in June to 16" the last time I measured them in November. I raised them in a 10 gallon aquarium until they reached around 6", then I moved them to a 29 gallon where they were until they were 12" or so, then I moved them to my 500 gallon pond in August where they grew to 16" by the middle of November. We continued to feed them plenty of quarantined feeders while they were in the pond, so they were able to have the energy necessary for attaining body size for winter. They're still in that pond, so I expect to find them at about the same size come spring, but I'm sure that they'll grow faster as the water warms up during late spring, summer, and early fall.

 

[screaminleeman]

Longnose gars don't really have the capacity to reach 6' in a short period of time. They grow fast for their first few years then growth slows down drastically.

Ponds are way different then aquariums. If you leave the gar in the pond year-round then it's going to stop growing for the winter, then it will start to rapidly grow again once spring comes back around. Rushing a gar to the minimum size needed for reproduction will only make for a smaller gar in the long run since it's going to be putting energy into growing its reproductive organs rather than overall body size.

For example, my two longnose gars went from around 2" when I got them in June to 16" the last time I measured them in November. I raised them in a 10 gallon aquarium until they reached around 6", then I moved them to a 29 gallon where they were until they were 12" or so, then I moved them to my 500 gallon pond in August where they grew to 16" by the middle of November. We continued to feed them plenty of quarantined feeders while they were in the pond, so they were able to have the energy necessary for attaining body size for winter. They're still in that pond, so I expect to find them at about the same size come spring, but I'm sure that they'll grow faster as the water warms up during late spring, summer, and early fall.

I have the outdoor deck pond (GarDen) all kinds of heated. I built the Waterbed heater (from my pre Tempurpedic days) into the base below the preformed plastic pond. I have two 300 watt submersible heaters also employed in the deck pond. I have to refill the pond an average of three times a week (This is the coldest December in central MD that I can remember) due to evaporation. The temp. has not dropped below 70 degrees F yet. All the Gar and my Bowfin in the outdoor pond are still eating just like it was summer (no difference to them). I do not forsee any challenge getting Logan to the 3' mark by this spring, however if it stops growing at the 3' size, I would not expect that it would survive the Herons, the inevitable Snapping Turtles or even the two LMB that have survived since I put them in there around eight years ago.

 

[Madding]

I don't foresee a YOY LNG in captivity reaching 6' reGARdless of the pond conditions.

 

[Wiggles92]

I have the outdoor deck pond (GarDen) all kinds of heated. I built the Waterbed heater (from my pre Tempurpedic days) into the base below the preformed plastic pond. I have two 300 watt submersible heaters also employed in the deck pond. I have to refill the pond an average of three times a week (This is the coldest December in central MD that I can remember) due to evaporation. The temp. has not dropped below 70 degrees F yet. All the Gar and my Bowfin in the outdoor pond are still eating just like it was summer (no difference to them). I do not forsee any challenge getting Logan to the 3' mark by this spring, however if it stops growing at the 3' size, I would not expect that it would survive the Herons, the inevitable Snapping Turtles or even the two LMB that have survived since I put them in there around eight years ago.

It's getting pretty close to breeding size. In the wild, males mature at two to three years of age and a length of about 24”, and females mature at three to four years of age and a length of 28” or more. I don't foresee it getting to 3' by spring, but I think that it may eventually exceed 3' in length.

It shouldn't have much trouble with the herons, turtles, or largemouth bass at it's current size, but it's always safer to let it grow more before introducing it to the farm pond. It has much better camouflage than the goldfish that are in the pond, so it should be able to blend in to stay safe from the herons. The snapping turtles shouldn't give it any trouble since it's way too big for them to easily eat; they would rather have bite size fish than some big fish with super tough scales. As long as there are plenty of forage fish in the pond, the largemouth bass shouldn't pose a problem as far as competing for food goes.

 

[Wiggles92]

I don't foresee a YOY LNG in captivity reaching 6' reGARdless of the pond conditions.

x2. Longnose gar don't typically even reach 6' in the wild nowadays...

 

[screaminleeman]

I don't foresee a YOY LNG in captivity reaching 6' reGARdless of the pond conditions.

I am not disbelieving anyone. I am TOTALLY freaking out realizing that my entire Gar collection stands a much better chance of survival by me throwing them in the microwave oven then I have of them being able to survive in mt 100'+ diameter 15' deep spring fed pond given the natural predators in the central Maryland area.

I have read of others keeping YOY raised gar in outdoor pond environments. I would think that we (Central Maryland) would have to be on the utter extreme low end of "predatory animals" in an environment where an outdoor pond could be used to "house" gar species.

How will YOY raised gar ever be able to survive red tailed hawks, much less Blue Herons, Raccoons, Foxes, Snapping Turtles.

I honestly feel sick to my stomach with this extreme rude awakening. Good Grief at this point, it seems like the best that I could possibly hope for with my gars (since I can NOT home them for life in my any of my indoor aquariums) is that they can make at least good snacks for my Bowfins (Also slated for the spring fed pond)!

Sheesh I wish that the goal that I made perfectly clear to begin with was explained much better by the experts here on MFK. For petes sake, I do not even have small gars anymore where I may be able to find them a decent home. I have avoided Gator Gar due to the impression that they got WAY THE SPUNK too big for my 100'+ diameter 15' deep pond.

Now I am under the impression that ALL SPECIES of gar that I own will be way too small to survive in my outdoor pond and that I should have been attempting gator gar all along as a species that could possibly grow large enough to reach my ultimate goal for them as residents of my farm pond.

To make it even worse, like I said, I am a newbie to indoor "aquarium" fish keeping. I do not drive. I have never even considered the thought of investigating what is "required" in order to "ship" fish. I have no concept of WHAT TO DO with these fish that I have grown fond of and CAN NOT HOME!

I DID try to do investigation before "jumping" into the raising gar for my farm pond and I WAS under FAR FROM given the impression by the experts here on MFK that I was in a total pipe dream attempting to drive a square peg into a round hole with a sledge hammer.

Hey Zander, I am sure that Singapore must have around ten predators to every one here in central MD. How do you guys protect your outdoor pond gar from the natural predation?

 

[screaminleeman]

x2. Longnose gar don't typically even reach 6' in the wild nowadays...

Now I must be mis-understanding how Gar are mesured. You can utterly trash any length(s) that I have stated on my Gars. I am measuring them from them from tail to the tip of the snout, wich is painfully obvious not the correct way.

How are gars "officially" measured?