Heating 1300g system

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
Do you have a gas water heater? Is your system anywhere near the water heater? If so you can use the water heater to heat your tank, it is what I'm using for my 1200 gal pond and 150 gal tank that are connected. I've got a couple backup 1000 watt heaters but the water heater alone will keep it at temp no problem. Pumps still cost me a bundle to run but at least heating it is cheap now. Let me know if you are interested, I can give a guide on setting it up if you would like.
 
fishguy306 said:
Do you have a gas water heater? Is your system anywhere near the water heater? If so you can use the water heater to heat your tank, it is what I'm using for my 1200 gal pond and 150 gal tank that are connected. I've got a couple backup 1000 watt heaters but the water heater alone will keep it at temp no problem. Pumps still cost me a bundle to run but at least heating it is cheap now. Let me know if you are interested, I can give a guide on setting it up if you would like.
Click to expand...

I'm interested. Can you please explain more.
 
Cool, it costs a bit more to set up in the beginning but long term it works out very well and will be cheaper in the long run instead of running the massive heaters. I can take some pics tonight of my setup if needed. As a note, this only works if you have a gas water heater, an electric one will cost you more in the long run than heaters.

You will still need a controller, though it doesn't need to be one capable of a ton of watts. I think there are those cheap ones called Rainbirds or something like that. I use a Ranco which will be backed up by my Reefkeeper. You will also need a circulation pump made for moving hot water to far away faucets. A solenoid is also a good idea to keep the water from circulating when the system is off. I'll give links to my materials at the end of this.

On the output from the water heater you put in a T, one line going to the rest of the house like usual, the other I connected to a PEX line, I used 1/2" for it. Run that line to your sump and coil up 50-75' of PEX. It is a pain in the butt to do and takes up a lot of space. The line then comes back out of the sump and back to the water heater, put another T on the inlet. Somewhere along the line add the solenoid and the circulation pump. The pump I have on the start of the loop, the solenoid is on the return side.

When the water temp drops, below 80* in my case, the controller gives power to the solenoid and pump which opens the solenoid and turns on the pump. Water then flows through the PEX loop, heating the water in the sump, warmish water then gets return to the water heater.

This system does have an impact on water temp in the house. If your water heater is older it may struggle with this system. If I'm in the shower I can notice when it turns on and off based on shower temps, so that is something to keep in mind.

This is the pump I use-
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B000E78XHG/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This is the solenoid. It does need to be wired but that is super simple-
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DQ17PHQ/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I found a few pics on my phone, hopefully these help as well.

First pic is where the lines attach to the water heater. Top of the pic shows the water going out. The pump is also in this pic. This is when I had it on the return side. Both are supposed to work, I'm not sure me switching it made it any better

20161026_003638.jpg

Second pic is the coil in the sump of my old setup. It is a 150 gal rubbermaid bin for reference. The red is the PEX line coiled up
20170108_205847.jpg

Last pic is my new setup. You can see the coil in the left tank. Not a great pic either but to give you an idea

20170226_232057.jpg

Let me know if you have any questions!
 
fishguy306 said:
Cool, it costs a bit more to set up in the beginning but long term it works out very well and will be cheaper in the long run instead of running the massive heaters. I can take some pics tonight of my setup if needed. As a note, this only works if you have a gas water heater, an electric one will cost you more in the long run than heaters.

You will still need a controller, though it doesn't need to be one capable of a ton of watts. I think there are those cheap ones called Rainbirds or something like that. I use a Ranco which will be backed up by my Reefkeeper. You will also need a circulation pump made for moving hot water to far away faucets. A solenoid is also a good idea to keep the water from circulating when the system is off. I'll give links to my materials at the end of this.

On the output from the water heater you put in a T, one line going to the rest of the house like usual, the other I connected to a PEX line, I used 1/2" for it. Run that line to your sump and coil up 50-75' of PEX. It is a pain in the butt to do and takes up a lot of space. The line then comes back out of the sump and back to the water heater, put another T on the inlet. Somewhere along the line add the solenoid and the circulation pump. The pump I have on the start of the loop, the solenoid is on the return side.

When the water temp drops, below 80* in my case, the controller gives power to the solenoid and pump which opens the solenoid and turns on the pump. Water then flows through the PEX loop, heating the water in the sump, warmish water then gets return to the water heater.

This system does have an impact on water temp in the house. If your water heater is older it may struggle with this system. If I'm in the shower I can notice when it turns on and off based on shower temps, so that is something to keep in mind.

This is the pump I use-
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B000E78XHG/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This is the solenoid. It does need to be wired but that is super simple-
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DQ17PHQ/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I found a few pics on my phone, hopefully these help as well.

First pic is where the lines attach to the water heater. Top of the pic shows the water going out. The pump is also in this pic. This is when I had it on the return side. Both are supposed to work, I'm not sure me switching it made it any better

View attachment 1245278

Second pic is the coil in the sump of my old setup. It is a 150 gal rubbermaid bin for reference. The red is the PEX line coiled up
View attachment 1245279

Last pic is my new setup. You can see the coil in the left tank. Not a great pic either but to give you an idea

View attachment 1245280

Let me know if you have any questions!
Click to expand...

You sir are a genius! But sadly my water heater isn't that close enough. It would have to travel about 20 '.
 
aldiaz33 said:
It's tough to say how many watts you'll need because a lot depends on how well you are able to insulate the tank. You will definitely want lids since a huge amount of heat would otherwise be lost if you had an open top.
I personally wouldn't go with less than 2 watts per gallon, so you would need the Ranco Temp controller that requires 2 dedicated circuits (two 15 amps circuits, would work, but two 20 amp circuits would be better).
But having said that, you may be better off heating the entire room if you are going to have multiple tanks running.
The room my tank is in is unheated. To give you and idea of what you might expect if you were to use electric aquarium heaters only: temps in my fish room get down into the low 50s during the coldest winter nights. During colder winter months, my heaters would come on for 5 or 6 hours per day to maintain 78F, which translates into around 325kWhrs per month. If your system is twice the size, you might expect to use double the amount of energy, so 650kWhrs per month. Multiply that by your cost per kWhr and you should have a ballpark estimate of what heating the tank may cost you.
I'm not sure what you pay for electricity, but I'm guessing you saw a pretty solid spike in your electric bill from running that 1.5HP blower for your fluidized filter. I think that spa air pump is way overkill; all you need is a nice consistent (fluidized) roll of the media...it doesn't need to be violently boiling. I know of people running only 50LPM of air through the same filter you have with success. A 50LPM pump would only pull around 50 watts, so you would be saving about 830 watts (or 600kWhrs per month). Using the more efficient/smaller pump should pay for itself in just a few months. If you are worried about 50LPM not being enough you can get a larger model and run air to different tanks if it ends up being too much.
Another thing to keep in mind is that if you decide not to heat the air in the room, when it gets down into the 60s, you'll be pumping that cold air into the fluidized filter, which will act like a giant chiller. I noticed that when I turned off my little air pump in my tank, the heaters would come on a lot less often. That might be something to keep in mind if you are trying to keep your heating/electric costs down. Designing a filter that won't act like a giant chiller in the winter may be the smart way to go.
Hope you are taking what I write as suggestions from someone who wants you to succeed as opposed to criticism. It sounds like you have big plans in the works and designing the system to run as efficiently as possible could save you hundreds, thousands or even tens of thousands depending on how long you have the setup running. Looking forward to seeing updates on your build! =)
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What's your thoughts on the MEDO air piston pumps? Which one would I need to power 2x 100g sumps?
 
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