id this paratheraps species

[cchhcc]

Just to clear up my position, the FISH isn't new in the sense it was just discovered in the last few months. What IS NEW is that is it apparently is going to be "officially described" as a new species.

The OP who owns these nice fish and I had a nice discussion last night. I sent him three reference book citations dating back as far as 1983 that featured what I believe to be his fish (the fene sp. Catemaco). He doesn't think his fish and that fish are the same, and he could very well be right. Apparently, it is at least a different race of that older fish. It could also be a completely different fish. That would be neat.

What is NOT arguable is the fish has been known to at the least a very select few for years. Irrespective of whether it's the better known piebald fene, it is IMPORTANT TO NOTE THE DATES ON THE DOCUMENTATION PROVIDED BY MOJARRAMAN. Dr. Miller's note dates from the early 90's for instance. You can't claim a new species while providing documentation that's almost 20 years old.

Again, as I've said before, the fish are beautiful. I hope they prove to be different than the already known pie fenes. My sense is they are a cool race of that fish, and it appears that fish will finally be "officially described" as its own species.

The OP and I don't have a problem communicating directly in a constructive way. I'd be happy to address anyone else's concerns in a similar manner through PM's.

 

[cchhcc]

Just one more thing. It's is curious that the first two posts from a new forum member would occur in this thread. And apparently that individual has, in his first post on the forum, chosen to single me out.

In the spirit of full disclosure, I can only wonder if that is the individual who was recently asked to leave MFK, just under another pseudonym.

And along that line of thinking, I've been told that several members think I am a certain vendor impersonating a civilian. Several people here know for a fact that's just not true.

 

[ira]

The fish is not the piebald fenestratus you speak of I have several 7-8" specimen of that variety and John compared the 2 when he piched them up even the spawning pairs look different from the Catemaco. Last week I posted an ad trying to get rid of a new spawn of piebald fenesrtatus.This is a great hobby and its good to see the passion but the hostility generated when pics are posted is amazing. If any other members have these great fish please post pics I would love to see them.

 

[cchhcc]

So is this Buddha's fish the same or different from the one that DC and others called Conkeli for years or a new race of that same fish. If so, which fish is being discussed in the documentation posted up?

Honestly just asking...

 

[ira]

You tube video of my piebald fenestratus
Mixed..Fenestratus, Dovii, Pearsi, etc....

 

[ira]

Sorry the vid did not post, the fish is the conkeli but honetly I have never seen JD, bocourti, and now Catemacoquestioned so much. This hobby is all the better with the infusion of wild fish, rare varieties when they are sold by other vendors and pics are posted by other menmbers the response is all positive. If for example these fish were from Jeff Rapps and the pics were posted by aquamojo what do you think the response would have been? We all know the answer to that, lets hope the respect shown to some members can be afforded to all. I'm a hobbist and I'm proud of the fish I've supplied so are the members who have recieved them, at the end of the day thats what is important me.

 

[cchhcc]

Ira, are the OP's fish, 'Conkeli', and 'Catemaco' all referring to the same fish, at least on the species level? The OP's fish is a newly offered race of that?

Or are you saying the OP's fish is indeed a completely new fish? If so, are you saying the other two are the same? If that's the case, which fish does the documentation point to?

IMO, based on all that's been indicated, all three are just different names for what used to be called piebald fenestratus (or marbled, or pink, etc.) and were considered part of the P. fenestratus species (just as colored citrinellus are the same species as grey citrinellus). Now, this fish is apparently about to be officially described by an ichtyologist as its own species separate from fenestratus. The "new" part is the OP's beautiful pair are a newly distributed race of that fish.

Is that correct? I hope so, because it would seem we could all be in agreement then.

 

[capefeartarheel]

Sorry the vid did not post, the fish is the conkeli but honetly I have never seen JD, bocourti, and now Catemacoquestioned so much. This hobby is all the better with the infusion of wild fish, rare varieties when they are sold by other vendors and pics are posted by other menmbers the response is all positive. If for example these fish were from Jeff Rapps and the pics were posted by aquamojo what do you think the response would have been? We all know the answer to that, lets hope the respect shown to some members can be afforded to all. I'm a hobbist and I'm proud of the fish I've supplied so are the members who have recieved them, at the end of the day thats what is important me.

Im glad you acknowledged that all the animosity as of late has been in relation to you & the several people you have supporting your business. In case its not 100% obvious, its all been in relation to your/their presentation, attitude, arrogance & downright disrespect that you & "your boys" have approached this forum with.

Ill have to say that it wasnt really you until the past several weeks, but Your "boys" come on here with absolutely NO KNOWLEDGE of anything other than what you may have told them (and what does that amount to, I dont know, could be a lot, could be more hot air) or what they have learned in their 10 months of membership here on MFK, yet run around with threads on F0 this and F0 that, talking down to other hobbyists...not even really knowing what F0 is or even what it is they really have. Then, they want to make comments such as "I only keep F0" and "Anything less than F0 is what I feed my fish" etc etc etc..Arguing with WAY more experienced hobbyists, being disrespectful to those that have contributed A LOT to some of us, especially in emergency situations.

I challenge you to find me ONE SINGLE post by Aquamojo or Rapps (only naming them because thats who you pointed out) that is 1/100th% of the arrogance, condescension, or falsely inflated ego that any of "your boys" have run a muck on here with. You wont find a single post like that from JR or AM anywhere. They are respectful, helpful, WAY more knowledgeable than just about anyone else on here and couldnt be more humble about it. They also know that they dont have to go around dropping their personal stocklists genealogy to try to impress people or let anyone know they know what they are talking about. Their responses and cooth can tell you that better than anything.

You know why? Because they arent some immature thug punks that think they can use F0 cichlids as a GD status symbol on an online fish forum. They know that at the end of the day, jobs, families, bills, gas, electricity, personal trials and tribulations etc matter a whole hell of a lot more than some fish they personally caught in Honduras 6 months ago...and whether its F0, F1, F3, some aquarium strain someone let go in a creek or whatever. NONE of it matters at the end of the day compared to real life issues.

Hopefully, out of all this "debating" and heated discussion, you guys have learned that you get respect when you give it, and that no matter what we know or think we know, there is ALWAYS someone right next to us that knows 100x more than we do. PERIOD. We'll never be able to change that, so its best to go ahead and get over it.

 

[caribemob]

Im glad you acknowledged that all the animosity as of late has been in relation to you & the several people you have supporting your business. In case its not 100% obvious, its all been in relation to your/their presentation, attitude, arrogance & downright disrespect that you & "your boys" have approached this forum with.

Ill have to say that it wasnt really you until the past several weeks, but Your "boys" come on here with absolutely NO KNOWLEDGE of anything other than what you may have told them (and what does that amount to, I dont know, could be a lot, could be more hot air) or what they have learned in their 10 months of membership here on MFK, yet run around with threads on F0 this and F0 that, talking down to other hobbyists...not even really knowing what F0 is or even what it is they really have. Then, they want to make comments such as "I only keep F0" and "Anything less than F0 is what I feed my fish" etc etc etc..Arguing with WAY more experienced hobbyists, being disrespectful to those that have contributed A LOT to some of us, especially in emergency situations.

I challenge you to find me ONE SINGLE post by Aquamojo or Rapps (only naming them because thats who you pointed out) that is 1/100th% of the arrogance, condescension, or falsely inflated ego that any of "your boys" have run a muck on here with. You wont find a single post like that from JR or AM anywhere. They are respectful, helpful, WAY more knowledgeable than just about anyone else on here and couldnt be more humble about it. They also know that they dont have to go around dropping their personal stocklists genealogy to try to impress people or let anyone know they know what they are talking about. Their responses and cooth can tell you that better than anything.

You know why? Because they arent some immature thug punks that think they can use F0 cichlids as a GD status symbol on an online fish forum. They know that at the end of the day, jobs, families, bills, gas, electricity, personal trials and tribulations etc matter a whole hell of a lot more than some fish they personally caught in Honduras 6 months ago...and whether its F0, F1, F3, some aquarium strain someone let go in a creek or whatever. NONE of it matters at the end of the day compared to real life issues.

Hopefully, out of all this "debating" and heated discussion, you guys have learned that you get respect when you give it, and that no matter what we know or think we know, there is ALWAYS someone right next to us that knows 100x more than we do. PERIOD. We'll never be able to change that, so its best to go ahead and get over it.

you come on here with a couple of of post and now you some type expert . Look me up on this forum, I have over 2,000 gal of running tank's in my house. I just don't have one or two like you and believe me I have fish you wish you had. It all started by me and others posting wild fish, which started a negative buzz because it didn't come from your average vendors. Its funny because you and cchhcc and a couple others don't even post fish you just comment and it's usually negative towards fish that you most likely can't get your hand's on. I'm a hobbyist that collect's piranha's all the way down to rio Naranja Jack Dempsey's. And believe me I never just hopped on someone's thread and got negative until people get ignorant first. Bottom line you guy's need to just post your fish and give positive feedback or nothing at all.

 

[cchhcc]

Caribe, I'm almost 500 posts smarter than you! ; )

Just search my posts and threads if you want to see some of my fish. I've got no desire to respond otherwise.

Since no one wants to explain the OP's fish anymore (post #87 for those who care), and it seems we've sorted out our Christmas Card list for the year, it's probably time to leave each other alone.