That wasn't meant to be rude, i apologize if my post offended you or anyone out there, just trying to throw out some constructive criticism
interest in asian aros
- Thread starter rottbo
- Start date
constructive critisism is fine but i am done being involved in this debate if anyone has a serious interest or question PM me otherwise i will b watching from the sidelines good luck to everyone
The biggest problem with this program of yours is money. It would take a lot of money and not to mention time to even set up such a program of whatever it is you're trying to accomplish. No one is going to invest both their time and money for a program that has a lot of possibilities for failure even though it may seem such a noble idea. And there's no way you can gain support for your program without a detailed explanation with all the why, what, where, when and how of it. And if you're going to give up on the debate just because of what may seem rude comments then I don't even see how you can get this thing going. If you think it can work and you want support then you're going to have to start convincing people.
I was shocked when I discovered that asian aros were illegal in the states. Pretty easy to find one here in Alberta, Canada. Although rather pricey.
Is there even a slight possibility that the US government could re-evaluate the CITES bannage and exempt proven, farm raised aros??? Maybe even act as middle men in the process and make some bucks if the demand is there??
Its just that if asian aros are available everywhere but the US, (remember, thats chipped, farm raised asians), wouldn't the ban on them seem kinda like an old, outdated law?
Is there even a slight possibility that the US government could re-evaluate the CITES bannage and exempt proven, farm raised aros??? Maybe even act as middle men in the process and make some bucks if the demand is there??
Its just that if asian aros are available everywhere but the US, (remember, thats chipped, farm raised asians), wouldn't the ban on them seem kinda like an old, outdated law?
They are CITES protected but that is not what makes them illegal here, they are listed by the U.S. Endangered Species Act and this is what makes them illegal. Many things that are available here are CITES protected including but not limited to Zebra Plecos, Arapaima, etc.
CITES paperwork is generally easy to get for most animals providing the steps are all correctly followed, it usually takes 2 weeks or so and requires a permit fee be paid.
Thank you for your email concerning the importation and potential
downlisting of Asian bonytongue, Scleropages formosus under the Endangered
Species Act (ESA). I have reviewed your email carefully, and would like to
share the perspective of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (USFWS) on this
issue of international importance.
The species was listed as endangered in 1976 under the U.S. Endangered
Species Act. Endangered foreign species, such as S. formosus, cannot be
imported to the United States for primarily commercial purposes even if
they are captive-bred. Importation for personal or hobby use would be
considered commercial activity. Furthermore, any importation of an
endangered species, captive-bred or not, must enhance the status of the
species in the wild in some direct way. In the past, the USFWS has
approved the import of small numbers of bonytongue for research and
captive-breeding purposes. The applicants in these cases are involved in
research or re-introduction programs that should help bolster wild
populations of the fish. Importation of farm-raised and selectively bred
bonytongue does not, in our view, enhance the wild populations directly.
While captive-bred populations of S. formosus may be abundant in Southeast
Asia, their use does not necessarily encourage the conservation of wild
populations and may result in unsustainable harvest for breeding stock.
These fears have been echoed by Indonesian scientists who I've consulted
while visiting the country and examining arowana farms.
It's important to note that these provisions of the ESA apply regardless of
the status of the species in the Convention on International Trade in
Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES), but that body has
recently concurred with an Indonesian report that the species remains
endangered throughout its range. There are no current or planned research
initiatives known from any range country (Malaysia, Myanmar, Cambodia,
Laos, Vietnam, and Indonesia) to study the conservation status of wild S.
formosus. Thus, there is no known scientific basis for downlisting from
threatened to endangered under the ESA in any part of the species' range.
Until data are presented to the USFWS or gathered, it appears that
downlisting is not warranted.
If we can obtain information that indicates that wild Asian arowanas are no
longer in danger of extinction, the USFWS will prioritize the species for
downlisting to threatened status. I am developing research initiatives to
gather this information. If the species is in fact downlisted to
threatened status, U.S. hobbyists could import captive-bred specimens with
the appropriate ESA and CITES permits. If you would like to learn more
about the Endangered Species Act, please visit our website at
http://endangered.fws.gov/. If you would like to learn more about the
USFWS, foreign species, and CITES, visit our website at
http://international.fws.gov/
Thank you for your interest in and committment to the conservation of Asian
bonytongue. I look forward to working with dedicated members of the public
such as yourself as we continue our investigations of this species'
recovery in the wild.
CITES paperwork is generally easy to get for most animals providing the steps are all correctly followed, it usually takes 2 weeks or so and requires a permit fee be paid.
Thank you for your email concerning the importation and potential
downlisting of Asian bonytongue, Scleropages formosus under the Endangered
Species Act (ESA). I have reviewed your email carefully, and would like to
share the perspective of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (USFWS) on this
issue of international importance.
The species was listed as endangered in 1976 under the U.S. Endangered
Species Act. Endangered foreign species, such as S. formosus, cannot be
imported to the United States for primarily commercial purposes even if
they are captive-bred. Importation for personal or hobby use would be
considered commercial activity. Furthermore, any importation of an
endangered species, captive-bred or not, must enhance the status of the
species in the wild in some direct way. In the past, the USFWS has
approved the import of small numbers of bonytongue for research and
captive-breeding purposes. The applicants in these cases are involved in
research or re-introduction programs that should help bolster wild
populations of the fish. Importation of farm-raised and selectively bred
bonytongue does not, in our view, enhance the wild populations directly.
While captive-bred populations of S. formosus may be abundant in Southeast
Asia, their use does not necessarily encourage the conservation of wild
populations and may result in unsustainable harvest for breeding stock.
These fears have been echoed by Indonesian scientists who I've consulted
while visiting the country and examining arowana farms.
It's important to note that these provisions of the ESA apply regardless of
the status of the species in the Convention on International Trade in
Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES), but that body has
recently concurred with an Indonesian report that the species remains
endangered throughout its range. There are no current or planned research
initiatives known from any range country (Malaysia, Myanmar, Cambodia,
Laos, Vietnam, and Indonesia) to study the conservation status of wild S.
formosus. Thus, there is no known scientific basis for downlisting from
threatened to endangered under the ESA in any part of the species' range.
Until data are presented to the USFWS or gathered, it appears that
downlisting is not warranted.
If we can obtain information that indicates that wild Asian arowanas are no
longer in danger of extinction, the USFWS will prioritize the species for
downlisting to threatened status. I am developing research initiatives to
gather this information. If the species is in fact downlisted to
threatened status, U.S. hobbyists could import captive-bred specimens with
the appropriate ESA and CITES permits. If you would like to learn more
about the Endangered Species Act, please visit our website at
http://endangered.fws.gov/. If you would like to learn more about the
USFWS, foreign species, and CITES, visit our website at
http://international.fws.gov/
Thank you for your interest in and committment to the conservation of Asian
bonytongue. I look forward to working with dedicated members of the public
such as yourself as we continue our investigations of this species'
recovery in the wild.
im far from educated on this particular topic. i do believe that we as human beings are the smartest most advanced lifeforms on the planet and i cant think of why your idea isnt possible. we put a man into outterspace, but we cant try and replenish the pop of a particular fish.. like i said im not real educated about all this, but im with you 100% and dont let all the critisism get you down.... for some reason people always want to tell you your wrong. HATERS. go for it man, what is the worst that can happen? 
rottbo said:
Find any major zoo or aquarium with them and get in contact with that animals primary keeper. Professional fish guys are more that willing to talk about fish.
I currently am not keeping any at this zoo. But that's because they haven't had fish before...so starting them with asian aros is pointless.
IoStrisciare said:
from this post all i can make out is what i have said for ages the asian aro stock being bred is crap and full of genetic defects and not good enought to be set free into the wild
if this is the case then i feel the farms are selling us the buys crap grade fish and should spend more time trying to breed out these defects and not pass them on to the public
farms should spend more time on the real strains of asian aros rather than the new types and deformed aros like the king aro and now the very long finned type the VIP red if this stuff carrys on the aro will be in the same mess as the cold water trade fish
This project or idea is NOT new. This was granted before by Fish and Wildlife. A couple of "breeders" were allowed to "Breed" asian aros, circa 1980's. The project just disappeared. Just because you have a bunch of arowanas in a big pool, does not mean they would reproduced. The reason they are prolific breeders in Asia is because their scientist use hormones to induce breeding. Also, the weather they have is the exact formula for breeding these fish. As you probably already know, they are bred in ponds, muddy, and probably water that is not equal to the water we have here. Japan also has success in breeding but they couldn't care less about the wild population. The project approved here in the US was unfruitful, there could have been problems along the way, that was unforseen. There is nothing wrong with your idea, but it was not the first. I myself have thought of doing this and even attempted to obtaining the specimens illegaly. Easier said than done. I have a contact that could get me asian aros from one of the farms in Indonesia, but the minimum purchase is $10,000.00. In addition, there is no way the US Fish and Wildlife would allow that shipment into the US. Great idea, but the task is surmountable.
