Is F3 (filial generation 3) weak brood?

[Rakeboy]

There is no general answer to this, as many different factors play a role.

The first thing to ask is what you consider weak.

That can be different things. Such as the susceptibility to diseases, aggressiveness, deformities, but also the body shape.

An F3 may not be able to flee from predators as quickly as an f0, but a well selected F3 may even be better suited for the aquarium than an f0, as they are better adapted to the germ load in the aquarium and can be less aggressive.

E.g. the M. beanie available here are almost all f9 or f10, but they are significantly better to keep in the aquarium than either f0 or f1. And you won't see any difference in appearance since they come from a well-established conservation program.

But there are also examples in the other direction. Like Copadichromis borleyi. Most breeders have always selected the most colorful males for breeding. In a group with several males, the most aggressive specimen is always colored the most. After just a few generations, the fish became significantly more aggressive.

So it depends on the breeder how much an f3 differs from an f0 and if that is something desirable or not.

So it depends on the species? Some species can be breed up to f10. In my case, dealing with cichlids. Is it possible that i can breed cichlids up to f10?

 

[Milingu]

So it depends on the species? Some species can be breed up to f10. In my case, dealing with cichlids. Is it possible that i can breed cichlids up to f10?

With cichlids it depends mostly on the selection by the breeder. If you select healthy parents from each generation, split your f1 or f2 in two or more breeding groups and recross them after a few generations you can breed for many generations without degeneration from inbreeding (there can be some degenerated specimens but there will still be enough flawless ones to continue breeding).
The f10 beanie I mentioned from the DCG conservation programm decended from one group of wild caught fish that were most likely all siblings from the same batch and if I remeber correctly in f2 or f3 only one wild caught female was added.

But it even works with less genetic variety. A lot of the lake victoria cichlids are in the hobby for many genertions and they decended from only a hand full of wild caught fish without ever getting any fresh wild blood.
Haplochromis latifasciata is good example to show what selection can do. Before they were caught again a few years ago there were only a few breeding lines in the hobby. Some still showing the vertical bars some slowly losing the bars over the generations. This loss of bars is something a good breeder would try to eliminate in his line.

 

[Kevin@TUIC]

My annotation is for F3 AND beyond. So anything after F2 I will list as captive bred so, essentially you will not find anything on my list that reads F3 attached to the species name or provenance. I may mention F3 in the species descriptions if I know that is the specific generation but I do not use it in the species names. Sometimes noting it in my description is helpful for those already working with a species and are looking to add more. An example would be a university I supply fish with here in the US. They study the genetic traits of fish that are captive bred from known wild stock, over each generation and see what, if any, changes happen. So for them, they specifically need to know F1, F2, and even F3. What many hobbyists may not know is that I do not only supply the hobby but TUIC works with the scientific community through several universities. Those entities need the purest stock in order to do the work they do. You may also see if you frequent the USGS site that many, many, of the species photos are noted as and come from TUIC.

For those that never looked or didn't notice, I include a key at the top of my stock list to understand the listings(see below photo).

so how do 'I' determine my fish as F1, F2. well, as the key notes indicate. If my wild fish spawn in house the juvenile I will offer will be F1. If I lose or sell the wild pair and only have the F1 fish left and they spawn, then those next juveniles will be F2. Anything after that, its just captive bred. I will list a provenance when I have one on F3 or greater but I will not use F3 in the listing name.
Also, I do not mix same species from different populations so anything with a filal # will be bred from fish only from the exact same provenance and more likely than not, for the same physical collection.

As far as do f3 show as well as wild or 1st generation. my answer is going to be yes. Assuming they truly are the correctly noted generation of course. If kept pure and responsibly bred you and I would be hard pressed to physically note a difference. in reality you would have to go quite a few generations in before they start to really look 'different'.
Personality wise.. I maaaay lean towards that the captive strains are so used to humans since the day they hatched that they will often be more outgoing from an early age/small size. Whereas wild fish are often more timid at first introduction. They just take a bit to understand humans = food time!

So, that's how I list my stock. I cannot comment or claim to know how others do it but, that is how we've always done it here.