is it alright to use pond filters on monster tanks?

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
philhawk;776955; said:
as we monster aquarists get tanks nearing or breaking the thousands of gallons there are fewer and fewer commercial options for filtration. my question is: is it alright to use pond filters on monster tanks? is there any reason not to use them ? to me they seem like an economical alternitive because most are reasonably affordable and are designed for the volume of water we need.

Here is another alternative. We use two spa filters run by a Hammerhead pump for superior mechanical filtration on our 300 gallon tank. With very innovative plumbing on our tank, there has been no debris or feces to vacuum out of the tank in the year+ it has been running...and we have six monster poop makers in the tank (two 20" pacu, two large oscars, two 12"+ plecos) I am positive this is what keeps our nitrates manageable..the solid waste is removed from the tank before it can become part of the nitrogen cycle. Very economical, extremely efficient mechanical filtration, great water clarity.
 
pacu mom;805747; said:
300 gallon tank. With very innovative plumbing on our tank, there has been no debris or feces to vacuum out of the tank in the year+ it has been running....

a self-cleaning, pooper-scooper??....like the idea:D could you please elaborate in your innivative plumbing?
 
ApacheDan;805794; said:
a self-cleaning, pooper-scooper??....like the idea:D could you please elaborate in your innivative plumbing?

In August 2005, my husband came across a 55 gallon tank at a moving away yard sale. The tank was chock full with eight big fish--four oscars, two 15" pacu, and two pleco. We were newbies who had to get online to find out which were the pacu and which were the oscars. Once we learned about the nitrogen cycle and keeping nitrates low, we were spending many hours every week doing 100% water changes every day. It took over an hour a day just to vacuum the feces out. We could only change out about ten gallons at a time, because of fish density. When we were setting up our 300 gallon tank, my husband was determined to make it as maintenance-free as possible. To accomplish this, we chose to have a bare floor in the tank. Besides the main mechanical uptake, we have two "poop suckers" strategically placed where the debris tends to eddy and swirl. These are 1" pvc pipe covered in black hose placed 1/4" from the floor. Debris and feces quickly drift across the floor and is removed from the tank. Here's a poor pic taken with a slow digital camera:
poopsucker001.jpg


The honest truth is that the first poop sucker prototype was very ugly and unsightly. It was a grid of pvc in an E shape which lay on the floor of the tank. A bunch of holes had been drilled into the pipe. I was glad when the grid was removed from the tank. By that time, we knew where the debris was going to concentrate. The Reeflo Hammerhead is a 1/3 HP, 5800gph pump which really circulates the water. There is a very strong current in the tank, which I'm sure, helps to move the debris along the floor.

The tank is not self-cleaning, but it is an extremely low maintenance tank. There are valves placed on all the pipes. On water change day, the pump is turned off and the valve to the drain pipe outside the house is opened. The water drains outside by gravity flow. We can dump 100 gallons in about 5 minutes. Earlier this year, we discovered that if we closed the valves to the main uptake and the poopsuckers, the water is siphoned up through the return nozzle in the tank. The water then backwashes the spa filter cartridges before being dumped outside. Of course, this only works for the first couple of inches of water, as the return nozzle is soon out of the water. The valves on the three uptakes are then reopened to quickly drain the tank. To expedite the refill process, we have a 55 gallon tank sitting on a high shelf in the filter room (a converted old furnace room directly behind the tank). It is full of heated, conditioned water. There is a pipe running from this tank to the mechanical filter system. We have a hose running from the utility sink up to the 55 gallon tank. When we're ready to fill the main tank, we open a valve and water gravity flows into the big tank, we also turn the water on at the sink to keep filling the 55.. If we've only removed 100 gallons from the main tank, we can very rapidly pump the water into the tank. If we remove 200 gallons, we don't turn the pump on until the main uptake is back in the water again. Here's a picture:

frah008.jpg


The tall vertical pipe on the far right is the line from the 55 holding tank. Directly behind it you can see the pipe which goes down and under the house and then outside to our patio--that's the dump line. The three horizontal pipes, each with valves, are the uptake pipes, and the oblique pipe behind the filters is the return line. There are also valves on the uptake pipes at the tank (safety).

This is a system strictly for mechanical filtration. It has far exceeded our expectations. I really didn't think it could be done--but I'm a believer now! We have a large ProClear wet/dry filter for biological filtration, and an FX5 with a UV sterilizer for redundant backup filtration. We have consistently had great water parameters with the nitrate usually around 20 ppm at water change time. This is phenomenal with our "overstocked" tank. I truly believe the solid wastes are removed from the nitrogen cycle. On another thread on this forum, someone said that unless we changed out the filter cartridge at every water change, we would be adding to the nitrate level. We've been changing the cartridge every two to three months when the water clarity changes. It's crazy and impossible to have nitrates as low as we have it, with all the feces and debris in the filter cartridges....which is why I say that the waste is not part of the nitrogen cycle once it is out of the tank. Just today we got a filter cartridge cleaner which will enable us to clean the cartridges and reuse them. I really don't think it will make a difference to replace them at every water change (we change out 200 gallons every Thur and Fri to get the nitrates super low).

The bottom line is that our spa filter system has enabled us to have the low maintenance system that we desperately wanted. A boatload of canister filters would not have achieved what we wanted and needed. We're happy, and our fish are thriving..they all love the swift current and the highly aerated water. The system periodically spits bursts of air which we caught in this pic:
newtank-02.jpg
 
Thank you very much, Pacu Mom, for taking your time to give so much detail. I will carefully study your reply & see what I can incorporate in my tank. I guess the key is to determine where is the concentration of debris/feces in the floor area to be removed. Like any custom system, this works for you...some ideas might work for my setup. :D Dan
 
After the revised system was running, we changed the direction of the return nozzle. That totally changed the currents in the tank and put the second poop sucker out of business. We could have gotten by with just one poop sucker in the middle of the tank. We chose to use only one of the overflow boxes. The return nozzle from the mechanical system is located between that overflow box and the side of the tank. The return sends the water to the far side of the tank, and the overflow box draws the water back to the other side, thereby really enhancing water circulation in the tank. If we had placed the return nozzle on the far side of the tank, we probably would have had a one directional current. If we had used both overflow boxes, the flow dynamics would have been totally different.

Yeah, for poop suckers to be really efficient, it would help to know where the debris was accumulating.:)
 
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