Israeli koi Vs Jap Koi

[Peter McFarlane]

Israeli koi Vs Jap Koi

Can anyone enlighten me on the difference between the two?
(Apart from the the location's there coming from etc)

I notice theres quite a price difference between the two, even when the fish are of similar size etc.

Is the price difference purely down to cost of importing etc? Or are koi from one area superior to that of the other?

 

[fishdance]

I am not Japanese but I know many Japanese people who would be offended by the term Jap Koi.

I think you will find the breeding philosophies and target markets are totally different between these two countries.

 

[oldfish]

The Japanese are the world leaders in koi.You'll find the skin quality, growth rates,selection and over all quality are the best with koi from Japan.Side by side its not even close.

 

[Bizzaro]

Ive been told the color of some Israeli koi are way more nicer then Jap. onces... but i have only delt and seen Jap. koi. Who supplying u Israeli ones? Once the ban/laws/rules is lifted or changes i know a good dealer. ill ask him what he think on the matter.

 

[Peter McFarlane]

I am not Japanese but I know many Japanese people who would be offended by the term Jap Koi.

Ah I didn't mean any offense, simply used "Jap" as an abbreviation. Most of my Japanese friends use that abbreviation too. Same as I wouldn''t get offended if someone referred to me as a Brit or even a paddy.

But sorry if it came across as if I meant any sort of bad in that comment.

Interesting comments guys, the "Japanese Koi" are definetly always higher priced around here. Personally I don't notice too much difference, but then I don't buy the Grade-A koi or take too much interest in the whole symmetrical patterns etc.

Saying that though, all the koi I see change hands for mega bucks are always "Japanese Koi", so they must have something over the Israeli fish.

Next time I go to my local koi seller I'm going to chew his ear and see what his reasoning is, we need to get more info on this!

 

[Peter McFarlane]

Who supplying u Israeli ones? Once the ban/laws/rules is lifted or changes i know a good dealer. ill ask him what he think on the matter.

Ps:

Bizarro... I do some work for an Israeli guy, he imports tropical fish. So I saw some koi he imported for his own pond and it got me interested cos I normally have to part with way too much money for my koi from LFS etc. I'm not no koi expert, I just like pond fish... So for someone like myself, always on the look for a bargain/cheaper alternative... but if the difference in quality is too much, then I'd rather pay more and have less fish...

I'm a bit worried now that people might be selling Israeli koi as Japanese koi and I wouldn't know the difference, so gonna try find some real answers or way to tell, save us guys getting shafted financially in the future!

Here's a lil clip of the guys Israeli fish, crap quality filming was just a camera phone. Next time I'm there I'll try get him to bag some up so I can get as decent photo.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UjFWv4-PtQ0

Ps. Whats this about a ban?

 

[hankn]

Israeli koi Vs Jap Koi

Can anyone enlighten me on the difference between the two?
(Apart from the the location's there coming from etc)

I notice theres quite a price difference between the two, even when the fish are of similar size etc.

Is the price difference purely down to cost of importing etc? Or are koi from one area superior to that of the other?

The Israeli and Japanese method of raising Koi is quite different.
The Japanese breeder
concentrates on one or two varieties and excels in these varieties -
achieving a very high level of fish. These are the fish that are usually
entered in competitions. The Japanese exporter will usually
represent a number of breeders - each contributing one or two varieties.
Israeli Koi breeders - Hazorea Aquatics or Magnoy concentrate on the mix and not on the individual varieties.
Their market is not the one selling 3 year old
champion Koi and most of what they do sell is less than one year old and
between 5 cm (2 in) and 30 cm (12 in) in size.

Another difference between Japanese and Israeli Koi is the coloration.
Japanese breeders rely heavily on color enhancement through special food,
clay etc. while in Israel coloration is ignored.
Japanese Koi are usually sold after they have completed a
special "finishing course" where they are fed special color enhancing food.
Most grades of regular Israeli Koi are taken
straight out of the growing tanks and shipped after only the usual
pre-shipment starvation. This is probably why many Japanese Koi will
loose color or fade without high quality special food while most Israeli Koi
will retain their color with regular food.

 

[hankn]

Ps:

I'm a bit worried now that people might be selling Israeli koi as Japanese koi and I wouldn't know the difference, so gonna try find some real answers or way to tell, save us guys getting shafted financially in the future!

Ps. Whats this about a ban?

Magnoy fish have genetic DNA markers that can be tested, since they use a KHV anti-virus (KV3) to innoculate their fish which adds this genetic marker. You can read more about it here:
http://www.magnoy.com/getfreefile.php?filename=164

The ban involves KHV (Koi Herpes Virus). KHV is a highly contagious disease that usually causes
death to about 80% of all Koi in a pond within 2 weeks and only targets Koi and carp (not goldfish).
Koi seem most susceptible at water temperatures of 72-81°F (22-27°C), but the full range of temperature is
64°F to 81°F (18-27°C). Koi will not get KHV at below 64°F or above 81°F.
External symptoms would be lesions and blisters, bleeding gills and sunken eyes. There is no treatment for KHV -
once your fish has it - it will either live or die.

Due to KHV, all governments require testing of the fish before importing. Magnoy goes the KV3 route whereas Hazorea Aquatics goes the Bio-secure route. See my sig for further details and links.

 

[oldfish]

Magnoy fish have genetic DNA markers that can be tested, since they use a KHV anti-virus (KV3) to innoculate their fish which adds this genetic marker. You can read more about it here:
http://www.magnoy.com/getfreefile.php?filename=164

The ban involves KHV (Koi Herpes Virus). KHV is a highly contagious disease that usually causes
death to about 80% of all Koi in a pond within 2 weeks and only targets Koi and carp (not goldfish).
Koi seem most susceptible at water temperatures of 72-81°F (22-27°C), but the full range of temperature is
64°F to 81°F (18-27°C). Koi will not get KHV at below 64°F or above 81°F.
External symptoms would be lesions and blisters, bleeding gills and sunken eyes. There is no treatment for KHV -
once your fish has it - it will either live or die.

Due to KHV, all governments require testing of the fish before importing. Magnoy goes the KV3 route whereas Hazorea Aquatics goes the Bio-secure route. See my sig for further details and links.

This is not completly right.First of all KHV is a virus and koi can often not show symptoms until there is an outbreak.Koi can get KHV below 64F.Koi that have it do not show it below 64F but can still spread it to other fish.When buying fish from anyone make sure the fish have been tested for KHV.Always quarintine any new koi you buy.

 

[hankn]

Koi can get KHV below 64F.Koi that have it do not show it below 64F but can still spread it to other fish.When buying fish from anyone make sure the fish have been tested for KHV.Always quarintine any new koi you buy.

Can you point me at any scientific study that shows that Koi can get infected with KHV at below 64F? I have looked and not managed to find any. For example ENACA - the Network of Aquaculture Centers in the Far East published a paper about KHV:
http://library.enaca.org/Health/DiseaseLibrary/Infection_with_koi_herpes_virus_Disease_Card.pdf
in which they state "While the virus may survive at low temperatures (5C), the temperature range for disease outbreaks appears to be 17-28C."