OMG! Baby BGK's!!

[moonchild1970]

Sometimes things happen without being 'Published'.

Sometimes published findings are overturned.

I believe in research as much as anyone else - but I also believe in some things that I can't 'prove' and I don't believe everything I read.

It can be done - it has been done - and it is being done. Those who talk about it or claim to have done it are met with just this sort of response.

I am not sure why it seems to upset some people so much.
I really thought that 'folks' here would be more supportive of others trying new things. I love to follow along as someone builds a new tank or talks about a new fish settling in. I try to learn as much as I can and be as supportive as I can.

Still searching for my larger tank but once I have it ready I will be ordering several BGKs - all very small - and letting them grow up together. I am taking this approach as I can't seem to find an adult for sale.

I guess those who can keep them alive and healthy rarely part with them.

Anyone with a 200+ gal tank for sale in Central Canada - please let me know - I am definately looking.

I don't know if I will be successful or not, but I can tell you that I will be trying. Just don't hold you breathe for me to 'publish' my findings... but I will provide lots of pics.

If live is not an adventure - it is just plain boring.

Exactly.

 

[Red Devil]

looking forward to seeing that sweet baby home in your tank... i know your missing your other guy .. how can you not ,,,they are wonderful fish, i hope that this guy will be just perfect and not aggressive so he will stay with you his lifetime..

 

[dmed]

I'm not sure that one should believe everything you read on Animal World or Aqualand, and the report from the pet shop in Australia has been investigated but was not substantiated and therefore I do not consider a "reliable source" at all. But, I haven't been there personally, so I'm not saying it's not true either. However, on my own I will make more attempts to find actual breeders just for my own curiosity, and I will check out the info. that was kindly provided. Meanwhile, I will refrain from making any more definitive statements about breeding BGK. Even though I have gone to considerable effort to investigate this, I agree that I very well could be mistaken. And even if I'm not mistaken, I get the overwhelming feeling that no one here would want to know anyway, so maybe I'll just keep that to myself....

Obviously BGK are breeding somewhere, either in the wild or in captivity, or both, so nothing is outside the realm of possibility, and I have never said that it could never happen, only that myself and many other interested parties have looked for a case and haven't found one yet that turned out to be credible. That doesn't rule out the possiblity that it has happened, and it definitely does not rule out the possibility that it could happen in the future. Personally I'm kind of hoping now that the first real instance will be C. Martin so we will all be privy to the pics, because baby BGK are exceptionally cute.

To the person who was asking about the journal articles, they are in my office and the university is closed for the holiday weekend, but I will be happy to share any citations that interest you next week.

Also, I definitely didn't notice your comment about waiting until the BGK had grown to the size of the bichirs, so my apologies to you for that confusion. I have seen some of your posts in the poly forum, so I know that you have kept bichirs for a while and I didn't say (or mean to imply) that you are stupid. I can't speak to how farm-raised BGK behave in a tank because I've never kept one, so I hope you will report on the differences you observe. Best wishes with your new BGK.

 

[moonchild1970]

Thank you dmed. Well he is home in the 15 with the Mollies. He's got a belly full of bloodworms. Got him some fresh shrimp, frozen beefheart, squid, and some different sinking pellets. One is plankton. So we will spoil him a little and see if he doesn't grow a little faster so he can go into my 75G tank sooner.

 

[dmed]

Thank you dmed. Well he is home in the 15 with the Mollies. He's got a belly full of bloodworms. Got him some fresh shrimp, frozen beefheart, squid, and some different sinking pellets. One is plankton. So we will spoil him a little and see if he doesn't grow a little faster so he can go into my 75G tank sooner.

I hope you will send some pictures our way when he gets settled in.

We see the small ones a lot in the stores and my daughter wants me to open another tank so we can get one. I like my BGK and I would replace it if it died, but I don't want a second one, so maybe I can just show her pictures of yours.

 

[dmed]

Oh - I remember your previous one had the cute name Snooky. Does your new baby have a name yet?

 

[aranos]

I'm not sure that one should believe everything you read on Animal World or Aqualand, and the report from the pet shop in Australia has been investigated but was not substantiated and therefore I do not consider a "reliable source" at all.

One should not believe everything one reads anywhere, especially on forums. But when multiple pet shops are telling you they're getting little BGK's from their asian importers, I think they should know. Not that it means that the many ornamental fish breeders and exporters in SE asia (I could find more than 10 online that are wanting to sell me boxes of black ghosts at anywhere from 1"-2.5" for as little as $.5/fish) are not collecting them from the wild, shipping them halfway across the planet, only to turn around and sell them back to the new world. Could be true, but I doubt it. Seems like a pretty slim profit margin to me. They say they've been breeding them for years now, and I can’t really think of a good reason why they would lie about that. Not to mention the new 'albino' black ghost morph that has been showing up lately that, to my knowledge, only ship out of Singapore and Indonesia.

I've never seen an article in a peer-reviewed journal saying that there is no evidence supporting captive farmed BGKs. Additionally, such an article would seem pretty sloppy to me if they haven’t investigated and discounted some of the many claimed-to-be breeders in SE asia. Nor have I seen an article in a scientific journal explaining how it has been accomplished. But I doubt the people who farm these fish, or those trying to breed them in the hobby are usually the type to write it up in The Journal of Experimental Biology. So that’s probably not the only place I’d look. All I’m saying is that “all the available evidence” does not point to “NO.” I haven't seen the farms personally, so I can't say they've done it for sure. But Occam would lead me to believe BGKs are bred in captivity.

 

[dmed]

I do agree with you that Asian importers would have to be crazy to buy up mass quantities of SA fish to distribute to NA. That is compelling information. Especially when there are Asian knife fish (which are commonly captive-bred). I will no longer say that it hasn't been done, as there are many things that happen in the world of which I have no personal knowledge. My interest in this topic started out as curiosity - I find other aspects of knife fish much more interesting and have no desire to breed one.

I have corresponded with someone who keeps many, many BGK in tanks together for long periods of time, and the tanks are frequently videotaped for research purposes, and no spontaneous spawning activity has ever been noted. So, I'm guessing that it's not simply a matter of putting two together. I think most people already acknowledge that. I have heard reports of breeding attempts using steroids, but I don't have any direct knowledge of that, either.

I have articles that describe captive mating of some other species of knife fish in great detail. I am going to summarize and post some of the more detailed ones in another thread. I would like to see someone who really loves BGK be able to breed them at home. There's also a whole lot of total B.S. about this on some other sites, so hopefully someone with the time and desire (and tank space) will do it and set things straight. I certainly don't want to be adding to the B.S., so I will not comment either way anymore!

 

[tezr]

Segrest farms a major wholesaler has farmed BGN on their lists. Where do they get them from I have no clue.
from their list
KNIFE GHOST BLACK T.R. SML APTERONOTUS ALBIFRONS
KNIFE GHOST BLACK T.R. REG APTERONOTUS ALBIFRONS
KNIFE GHOST BLACK T.R. MED APTERONOTUS ALBIFRONS

 

[tezr]

I do agree with you that Asian importers would have to be crazy to buy up mass quantities of SA fish to distribute to NA. That is compelling information. Especially when there are Asian knife fish (which are commonly captive-bred). I will no longer say that it hasn't been done, as there are many things that happen in the world of which I have no personal knowledge. My interest in this topic started out as curiosity - I find other aspects of knife fish much more interesting and have no desire to breed one.

I have corresponded with someone who keeps many, many BGK in tanks together for long periods of time, and the tanks are frequently videotaped for research purposes, and no spontaneous spawning activity has ever been noted. So, I'm guessing that it's not simply a matter of putting two together. I think most people already acknowledge that. I have heard reports of breeding attempts using steroids, but I don't have any direct knowledge of that, either.

I have articles that describe captive mating of some other species of knife fish in great detail. I am going to summarize and post some of the more detailed ones in another thread. I would like to see someone who really loves BGK be able to breed them at home. There's also a whole lot of total B.S. about this on some other sites, so hopefully someone with the time and desire (and tank space) will do it and set things straight. I certainly don't want to be adding to the B.S., so I will not comment either way anymore!

Probably the same farms that breed Bichirs with hormones inducted spawning.