ok i got the solenoid and not impressed... i'm thinking of returning it and doing the digital timer/float valve route, letting the timer dictate how much water to change/dilute an hour.
opinions on my auto water changer design
- Thread starter clekchau
- Start date
why dont you just add the digital timer to the solenoid? also a float switch that works off of magnets http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/MADISON-Switch-2A554?Pid=search with a normally open and a normally closed switch, and an off delay timer http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/DAYTON-Time-Delay-Relay-6A859?Pid=search. how it will work, is if the power is on, the solenoid will be open filling the tank with water. once the water reaches the float switch, the normally closed side of the switch which the solenoid is connected to will open, cutting off the power to the soleniod stopping the tank from overfilling. while still maintaining the failsafe if the power shuts off water will stop flowing to the tank. at the same time, the normally open side will close, activating the off delay timer. the timer will be controlling your pump and depending on the amount of time you adjust the delay for will dictate how much water will be pumped out of your sump. once the time runs out the pump will shut off. and the tank will start filling again.the electrical controls are all industrial so will easily handle over a million cycles without failure. by using a mechanical float valve, theres a substancially higher chance of failure. magnets dont fail under normal operatiing conditions. doing it this way has all of your bases covered as far as failsafes. if your worried about pumping to much water out of the sump add a second float switch that will cut power to the pump if it ever sticks on. also can hook your main pump(s) to this same switch if for whatever reason your sump were to run dry will shut all your pumps off protecting your equipment and a flood.
will also need to add http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/OMRON-Square-Base-General-Purpose-Relay-5ZJ04?Pid=search and its base http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/OMRON-Relay-Socket-4KN18?BaseItem=5ZJ04 for that float switch. allow the float switch in a normally open state to activate the coil in the relay. when the water hits the switch, the switch closes sending the signal to the coil opening the conact for the solenoid, and closing the contact for the off delay timer to the pump. if you need me to draw a schematic out for it i can. its easier then it sounds. and i can walk you through it.
let me rephrase what i said. still would need a relay timer and switch, but have the switch in the normally closed position, that will keep the coil on the relay closed. the solenoid would be on a NO contact and the timer will come off a NC contact. by doing it this way, if your coil in the relay ever fails, the water will be shut off going into the tank.
ok i'm getting conflicting statements, is a float valve less reliable than a float switch or more? i thought they were prone to sticking? i never tried a veritical float switch like i have now but i've had many liquid level float switches specifically ato fail in my saltwater setup.
In my personal experience float valves are much more reliable than float switches - I've had two float switch failures in about 14 years, my float valves have never had a failure.
A float valve is a simple mechanical device, it can only fail by breaking or being obstructed by mineral build-up or foreign matter. A float switch can fail by breakage, obstruction, corrosion of contacts or wiring, or failure/breakage of internal switch components.
Another factor to look at is how they fail. With float valves the most common failure by far is a slow drip caused by build-up or the wearing-out of the closure. This is the sort of thing you should notice (the sump is slightly fuller one day, or at worst it overflows slightly and you have a little water in your pit) before a catastrophic mess. A float switch failure will result in the sump/ejector pump not turning on and an overflow (of 100+ gallons in a day, in your case).
As far as figures on reliability, it is hard to find anything general, most data focuses on a specific make/model of component rather than float switches or valves in general. However, from my background as a plumber I know that float valves are extremely common (almost every residential toilet employs one) and are very reliable for the huge amount of service they endure. Float switches are found in both sewage and groundwater sumps and are so prone to problems that alarms are required in sumps to alert users of failure.
ok good cause although i 100% appreciate frickr's input it was confusing the heck out of me, digital timer programmed to solenoid that floats a switch up a magnet with a delay, also need to add some relay that allows the float to recoil normally and a partridge in a pear tree
the float valve/digital timer option seems easier... to say the least!
no matter what you use theres a risk for failer, the switches i posted are a magnetic reed switch, and are rated for over 5 million cycles. with proper maitenance, they will last a very long time, same thing with a properly maintained float valve. the same problems you will have for one you will have for other. float switches are used in all kinds of industrial applications. if you want something that will never fail, then your options are limited to an ultrasonic sensor that will never come into contact with the water. talk to a plumber, his simple mechanical stuff will be better, talk to an electrician, his simple electronic stuff will be better. i like being able to control more then one thing with one switch. keeps the whole thing looking cleaner and more organized. place the relay and time in a box, use all watertight connections, and you will have a very reliable clean looking set up. if you decide to use the mechanical switches, it can be just as reliable.
the reason why the switches failed is where they are used. sewage and groundwater sumps are Very dirty. a machanical switch would have failed alot sooner then the electrical switch.
the reason why the switches failed is where they are used. sewage and groundwater sumps are Very dirty. a machanical switch would have failed alot sooner then the electrical switch.
