PLEASE!!!! Dying turtle!

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Natalie;4870691; said:
The sad fact of the matter is, home treatment isn't going to substitute for proper veterinary care. Since the OP stated he can't go to the vet,the best he can hope for in that situation is to apply silver sulfadiazene or topical antibiotics and provide optimal husbandry while the animal is recovering. Please stop the argument about whether the animal is septic or not. There's no way to tell that without proper diagnostic work.

I was not arguing that at all Natalie, I said that from the OP's description it sounded like it was septic. What I am arguing is the way Coura is pushing a band-aid treatment for something he is trying to diagnose by eye without addressing the main issue here which is a lack of understanding of the problem itself. I understand that a vet is not an option in this situation and that is exactly why I recommended purchasing the book that is one of the single best Herpetological veterinary medicine texts in use today. It is something every serious keeper, especially those without access to veterinary services should keep handy.
 
LRM;4870698; said:
I was not arguing that at all Natalie, I said that from the OP's description it sounded like it was septic. What I am arguing is the way Coura is pushing a band-aid treatment for something he is trying to diagnose by eye without addressing the main issue here which is a lack of understanding of the problem itself.

Okay I understand.
 
LRM;4870698; said:
I was not arguing that at all Natalie, I said that from the OP's description it sounded like it was septic. What I am arguing is the way Coura is pushing a band-aid treatment for something he is trying to diagnose by eye without addressing the main issue here which is a lack of understanding of the problem itself. I understand that a vet is not an option in this situation and that is exactly why I recommended purchasing the book that is one of the single best Herpetological veterinary medicine texts in use today. It is something every serious keeper, especially those without access to veterinary services should keep handy.
to me, it doesnt matter crap what he is, as long as the stuff im doing elps him get better. by the way his name is Delta. i dont remember what it means but i named him that cause at first i thought he was a she.
 
LRM;4870625; said:
-18years of experience working with reptiles
-6 years education specializing in wildlife
-primary keeper at our animal housing facility for a critically endangered species of turtle

What are your qualifications exactly? Because honestly all I'm seeing from you is an amateur hour home remedy that is being pulled out of the air. Coating a rotting wound in something oily simply inhibits gas exchange and promotes the develop of anaerobic bacteria. A swelling at the border of a necrotic lesion and living tissue is an inflammatory response of the living tissue and in no way means that the tissue damage is going to stop at that point. In fact too much swelling will result in a decrease in blood flow and can exacerbate the situation by starving the cells and making them more susceptible to infection.
There is no need for a specific breaking point if you are surgically removing the dead tissue. It is a well known wound treatment process called debridement and if you were worth your salt in medical advice you would already know that.
Do not presume to tell me I am giving the OP poor advice when all you have done is push your home remedy and promote your pseudo-expertise.
My pseudo expertize you say its the best I can pull out to help a person and a turtle in need under not perfect treatment circunstances with a tecnicke I used with MANY animals, from iguanas and anoles including situations I could have gone for much more sofisticated tools but insted I choose this one because I know it works. The ideal actually would be to combo this with a injectable specific antibiotic treatment but this is again the best we can come up with. Your being extremelly impractical! How do you expect that the person that has this turtle is able to practice this "surgery" under safe and etic conditions for the turtle without further endangering its situation? Its not like he should pull out a knife and cut it like that! And that considering that the turtle is actually healing itself already, the lump separating the dead tissue indicates that the turtle body is rejecting it! The fatty cream will swell up the tissue and make it easier to do that. Tryed it many times, it works like a charm, and unlike amputation it has the great advantage of you not having to cut true living tissue. The only situation I advice amputation is when infection is spreading like krazy up the limp, situation I dont see here, the body is rejecting the dead tissue. And again turtles are NOT like mammals or birds, they can survive injures much more damaging then this one, even by their own in the wild.
And now lissen here KIDO, I have 20 plus years of being a turtle, lizard, fish and small animal keeper and ocasional breeder; I have contacted literaly with hundreds of species in the wild and captivity; I have helped MANY people with problems with their animals; I treated and reabilited allot of both exotic and native wildlife; I am called to a local veterinary center when ever they get in someone with a desiased reptile; I have a 5 year marine biology degree; I am finishing my master degree in aquaculture and Im regulary invited to give presentations and workshops on my campus about reptiles, plants and other nature related themes. I dont have a wildlife reabilitation degree even to they are easily available in my area because: a) there isnt anything they can teach me that I dont already know or that I cant easily find in my many books b) I already worked in wildlife rehab as a volunter and I cant stand it, these centers are at least here managed by bunch of %&$# arrongant pseudo cientists that only do what fits their personal agendas and dont care, dont lissen and I enter easily in conflict with them so I fly solo now, but wont think twice to help wildlife in need and C) wildlife rehab centers are low bugget slave labor institutions, that doesant work for me. Plus they HATE exotic animal hobbists so yea...
 
Natalie;4870691; said:
The sad fact of the matter is, home treatment isn't going to substitute for proper veterinary care. Since the OP stated he can't go to the vet,the best he can hope for in that situation is to apply silver sulfadiazene or topical antibiotics and provide optimal husbandry while the animal is recovering. Please stop the argument about whether the animal is septic or not. There's no way to tell that without proper diagnostic work.
Dude sceptic turtles get their plastrons filled with blood vessels and their eppidermis falls to reveal a raw underlayer of skin, its completly obvious, Fortuantly isnt the case, at least yet.
 
LRM;4870698; said:
I was not arguing that at all Natalie, I said that from the OP's description it sounded like it was septic. What I am arguing is the way Coura is pushing a band-aid treatment for something he is trying to diagnose by eye without addressing the main issue here which is a lack of understanding of the problem itself. I understand that a vet is not an option in this situation and that is exactly why I recommended purchasing the book that is one of the single best Herpetological veterinary medicine texts in use today. It is something every serious keeper, especially those without access to veterinary services should keep handy.
Oh yea that should arrive at its home rigth on time to save the turtle. However it is a good purchase;) Its just we are a litle short on time.
 
coura;4870810; said:
My pseudo expertize you say its the best I can pull out to help a person and a turtle in need under not perfect treatment circunstances with a tecnicke I used with MANY animals, from iguanas and anoles including situations I could have gone for much more sofisticated tools but insted I choose this one because I know it works. The ideal actually would be to combo this with a injectable specific antibiotic treatment but this is again the best we can come up with. Your being extremelly impractical! How do you expect that the person that has this turtle is able to practice this "surgery" under safe and etic conditions for the turtle without further endangering its situation? Its not like he should pull out a knife and cut it like that! And that considering that the turtle is actually healing itself already, the lump separating the dead tissue indicates that the turtle body is rejecting it! The fatty cream will swell up the tissue and make it easier to do that. Tryed it many times, it works like a charm, and unlike amputation it has the great advantage of you not having to cut true living tissue. The only situation I advice amputation is when infection is spreading like krazy up the limp, situation I dont see here, the body is rejecting the dead tissue. And again turtles are NOT like mammals or birds, they can survive injures much more damaging then this one, even by their own in the wild.
And now lissen here KIDO, I have 20 plus years of being a turtle, lizard, fish and small animal keeper and ocasional breeder; I have contacted literaly with hundreds of species in the wild and captivity; I have helped MANY people with problems with their animals; I treated and reabilited allot of both exotic and native wildlife; I am called to a local veterinary center when ever they get in someone with a desiased reptile; I have a 5 year marine biology degree; I am finishing my master degree in aquaculture and Im regulary invited to give presentations and workshops on my campus about reptiles, plants and other nature related themes. I dont have a wildlife reabilitation degree even to they are easily available in my area because: a) there isnt anything they can teach me that I dont already know or that I cant easily find in my many books b) I already worked in wildlife rehab as a volunter and I cant stand it, these centers are at least here managed by bunch of %&$# arrongant pseudo cientists that only do what fits their personal agendas and dont care, dont lissen and I enter easily in conflict with them so I fly solo now, but wont think twice to help wildlife in need and C) wildlife rehab centers are low bugget slave labor institutions, that doesant work for me. Plus they HATE exotic animal hobbists so yea...

Noted, I still maintain my reservations on the subject. It is apparent to me my input on this matter is unwanted so I will leave it at that.
 
coura;4870810; said:
I dont have a wildlife reabilitation degree even to they are easily available in my area because: a) there isnt anything they can teach me that I dont already know or that I cant easily find in my many books b) I already worked in wildlife rehab as a volunter and I cant stand it, these centers are at least here managed by bunch of %&$# arrongant pseudo cientists that only do what fits their personal agendas and dont care, dont lissen and I enter easily in conflict with them so I fly solo now, but wont think twice to help wildlife in need and C) wildlife rehab centers are low bugget slave labor institutions, that doesant work for me. Plus they HATE exotic animal hobbists so yea...

I'm very sorry you feel that way. I work in the wildlife industry and love almost every single one of my colleagues because we believe in teamwork and working together towards one common cause: improved animal welfare. If there's one thing wildlife med and rehabilitation has taught me, it's that you never stop learning because new things are always being discovered. I'm sorry you have such a skewed viewpoint of wildlife rehabbers... We're actually pretty good people, clearly not in it for the $$$ but rather for our love of animals.
 
Natalie;4871006; said:
I'm very sorry you feel that way. I work in the wildlife industry and love almost every single one of my colleagues because we believe in teamwork and working together towards one common cause: improved animal welfare. If there's one thing wildlife med and rehabilitation has taught me, it's that you never stop learning because new things are always being discovered. I'm sorry you have such a skewed viewpoint of wildlife rehabbers... We're actually pretty good people, clearly not in it for the $$$ but rather for our love of animals.
Im not saying every one is like this, but at least here that is the reality and everysingle moment I went to spend with those people I felt I was being brain washed. Plus the age old hate that they have toards exotic animal lovers that they straigth away catalog as smugglers, resulted in a pretty toxic atmosphere for me. Got out as soon as I could.
 
LRM;4870853; said:
Noted, I still maintain my reservations on the subject. It is apparent to me my input on this matter is unwanted so I will leave it at that.

Might want to work on your grammar. I'd expect more from a postgrad.
Your imput is wanted and wellcomed however you have to think about PRACTICAL solutions that can apply to this particular situation. I would love as well to have practicized cultures of every single pathogen strain I came across and in this case as well to know presicely wich antibiotic, fungicide or something else to apply that could directly atact it. However that aint gonna happen, and Im not saying my solution will even save this turtle, Im just saying this a way to deal with this situation that I have tested and in many cases worked perfectly. It is not getting here sugesting things that if they are not made with someone completly aware of turtle anatomy, anesthetics and surgery could result in disaster. Please dont make it worse then it already is.

As for my grammar, I think its a pretty good one for a Portuguese guy awake at 2 in the morning, thank you very much.
 
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