Pleco's, Bioload, and Feeding

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ragin_cajun

ragin_cajun

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Sep 8, 2013
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So I got a 4 inch Gold Nugget, and he's the biggest fish in the tank right now. He's been in the tank just over 2 weeks. I've also seen Nitrates get up to 40-60 ppm for the first time in this 125 Gallon. My first Pleco, so I'm thinking the Pleco is putting out A LOT more Ammonia than other normal fish? (2-4 inch CA/SA Cichlids). I'm just finishing up my THIRD 50% WC in the last 3 days, trying to get Nitrate levels down to 0ppm, 5ppm, 10ppm, maybe. Do Pleco's just load the tank up more than cichlids?

Also, I've never SEEN this fish eat anything but slime off the driftwood (Mopani). I put lettuce, zucchini, and some pellets out for him at lights out every night. In the morning, the pellets are all gone, but I have no idea who's eating them. Could be one of 3 Pictus cats, the 5 Clown loaches, or the Pleco. I do see LOTS of Pleco turds everywhere, so I assume the Pleco is eating something when I'm sleeping? Seems like to me the Pleco would eat pellets during the day, too though? Never does. Not happening.

So, is the Pleco eating way more than I realize, and that's why the high nitrates? Is my tank overstocked? Oh, and I'm in the second week of high water temp's because I'm treating for ich--keeping water temp at 88, no med's cause I've got plants/Clown loaches/catfish. No salt, either--just 88 degree water.

Here's my stock list-
1-3 inch Syn
2-2 inch Green Terror
1-2 inch Jack Dempsey
4-1 inch Sajica
5-1 inch Clown Loaches
3-3 inch Pictus
1-4 inch L177 Pleco
7-1 inch BA Tetra

API Master test kit I know works cause my LFS gets the same readings I do with their test kit. Tap water reads 0 ppm Nitrates--Yellow. pH is 7.8. Ammonia and Nitrite reads 0. 2 Eheim 2217 Canister filters. Water lettuce and 2 small Pothos plants that are growing slowly. 2-36 inch Finnex Ray 2 lights 6 hours a day. 2-36 inch 25 Watt T8 "Full Spectrum" about 10 hours a day.

Thanks
 
Interesting observations, I find it hard to believe that a single little plec would have that much influence on the nitrate readings, unless you've greatly increased the amount of food you're adding in to try give it the opportunity to eat (which would mean the other bottom dwellers are eating more and making more waste). Might be a bit obvious, but have you checked the nitrate of your tap water?
 
David R said:
Interesting observations, I find it hard to believe that a single little plec would have that much influence on the nitrate readings, unless you've greatly increased the amount of food you're adding in to try give it the opportunity to eat (which would mean the other bottom dwellers are eating more and making more waste). Might be a bit obvious, but have you checked the nitrate of your tap water?
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First thing I checked. My test kit is saying 0 ppm nitrate for my tap water. I'm definitely feeding more since I got the Pleco hoping he'll eat at night. All this talk about Gold Nuggets dying after 3 weeks has me real nervous about him not eating :) I guess what I need to do is try a divider one night, get the Pleco all by himself and drop some pellets in at night to see if he's eating them. I wish I had a quarantine tank, could have put him in that a few weeks to be sure he eats before putting him in the community.
 
You think I'm overstocked?
 
ragin_cajun said:
I wish I had a quarantine tank, could have put him in that a few weeks to be sure he eats before putting him in the community.
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I'm not sure that would help, there would still be an acclimatisation period when moved into the big tank. I haven't seen my L81 nugget eat for months, every now and then I'll catch him out and about, same with my L14s, saw two of them out feeding this week for the first time since adding them to the big tank!

IMO the nitrates will be a reflection of the amount of food you're adding, though I agree with Warborg that your stock doesn't seem excessive. Theoretically a couple of 50% changes on consecutive days should get it under control, and from there it is just a matterof seeing how fast it rises to work out how frequently you need to change water.
 
First of all, fantastic post! Very informative and well thought out question!

Regarding not seeing it eat. It usually takes a few weeks for plecos to settle down and get used to the environment. My L18s have been around for over 3 years, you still don't see them come out to the open and eat much. Some are just more shy than others, even within the same species. Just keep your eyes on it's tummy. As long as it's not sunken, you are likely in good shape. The lettuce and zucchini may or maynot have been eaten up by the pleco. The CL, may devour them as well if they are hungry. There's a LFS in my area that feeds his CL carrots and lettuces. Cheap and doesn't mess up the water.

The nitrate thing is a little harder to figure out. With 125g, nitrate shouldn't climb that much unless there's big increase in leftover food or waste. The only thing I can think of is your canister filters. When was the last time you cleaned them? It could be that there were a decent amount of waste in them already. When you bumped up the temperature to 88 for the ich, it sped up the rate of decomp of the waste matter, thus increasing the nitrate. The increase of food you added for the pleco being eaten up by everyone definitely will add to the nitrate. Your filter should be able to handle the bioload, but that only goes towards keeping ammonia and nitrite at 0, doesn't nothing for the nitrate. With the pothos on your tank, I guess you already know that everything you add to the tank goes to your nitrate level, can only be removed with WC, plants, or de-nitrating pain in the ass slow systems.

btw, you had your pleco for 2 weeks, and you've been raising temp for 2 weeks. Did ich came with the pleco?
 
No, ich treatment started before the Pleco went in the tank. I think, but not sure, that ich came into the tank with a shipment of plants. I bought Java Fern, Anubias, and Valisneria plants. Shortly after that all the fish (except for the Jack Dempsey) started flashing, shaking their pectoral fins, showing white dust on their fins. So I bumped the tank temperature, it fixed the cichlids right up. But the Clown Loaches are MUCH slower to improve. The Gold Nugget went in after the cichlids started improving and has never shown any signs of ich.

I took one canister apart a week or so ago, rinsed out the sponges in tank water, ceramic balls didn't look dirty at all. But the water IN the canister looked like ditch water -- real dirty. So I just poured it all out the canister, left the ceramic balls alone, put back in the rinsed sponges and recharged the Purigen. Did the same thing to the other canister. The Purigen turned dark brown VERY quick, though. Like in less than a month, the bag was dark brown. I thought they should last 3-4 months.
 
Perhaps the purigen was helping with the nitrate. It got saturated and was no longer helpful. Did you follow the recharge instruction closely? what color are they after the recharge. Well, even if you do follow the instruction, they won't be as effective as new ones. The claim of months n' months of effectiveness is bs, it's all up to the bioload. When I do use mine, they get used up within a month.

Nitrate level of 40~60 isn't that bad yet for these fish, just do more WC, put in couple more pothos, and shine more light on them to help them grow more. How often do you do WC and what % do you change out before you noticed the spike?
 
Yep, recharged Purigen in bleach, soaked it in Prime and tap water a night after that to get all the bleach/chlorine off it. It's now a nice off-white color, bout the same as it was when it was new. 40-60 ppm isn't bad for nitrates, but it's the highest I've ever seen in my tank, it's a new high so it deserves attention. I guess I"ll start doing 50-60% water changes every week, feed a little less, test nitrates more often. Seems like a lot of water changes, though. How ofter do you do water changes?
 
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