"Pros and cons" experienced comments please
- Thread starter TheBlackRayGuy
- Start date
I have had bad experiences when top coating polyester with epoxies ( been in the fiberglass business professionally for nearly 26 years and have first hand experience mixing the types of resigns ) , I know all the literature says that epoxy sticks to polyester just fine..... only on well cured poly-ester.... and professionally I never mix the two If it made with polyester repair are either poly or vinyl ester.... anything below the waterline should be vinyl-ester and with that stuff it needs to be primed with vinyl-ester primer. I know epoxies are far more expensive but in the long run epoxies flex and stretch better the Esters do , I just believe that if price is not an issue total layup and top coat use some form of NON Blushing epoxy (which you can pigmented to the color of your choosing )Longevity and performance were key at the beginning of the thread and cost didn't matter....wants the best
If this is true why is bath tubs, boats, pools and hot tubs jet skies wave runners all gel coat and fiberglass?Wow alot of people have misconceptions about fiber glass. a Fiber glass does absorb water even when gel coated, gel it self if very pores , it is not able to spend it entire live span wet .b the chems used it are harmful to fish and take years to flash. c if you dont get the ratio resign to cloth just right it becomes either bridle(with to much resign) or full of air bubble( not enough resign to fill the cloth) and the resign has no strength at all with out cloth and will crack . and that just for the start...I work with it everyday and have been for the last 25 years...... not good for Tank builds
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
I thought of gel coat again because back to boats....water crafts ect.... Not sounding so good after reading this... Would you highly recommend and coating for after the fiberglass?It sounds like you're thinking about the plywood less in terms of structure but more in terms of a form and possible the exterior look? Is that right?
In that case I think you should use a mid range lay-up polyester. Look and see what you can get locally first. Buy in bulk if you think you'll need 5 gallons.
With the money you save on polyester (vs. epoxy) I would invest in fiberglass cloth and/or roving instead of mat. Mat is cheaper but takes more resin to wet out and boat builders believe it is more likely to compromise the water proofing since the random fibers of the mat are thought to provide a path for water to migrate into the composite layers. There are good articles about this online. A lot of information to wade through but if I were building a tank I'd go back and read through it again.
I understand your thoughts about constant submersion for a polyester/fiberglass composite but I'm still confused as to why you plan to use both a gel coat AND another sealer (epoxy or liquid rubber).
I would instead think of the gel coat as the final layer. Maybe look into epoxy gel coats. I've never used them but they're supposed to adhere well to polyester and provide a more durable final layer. My only concern with them is I don't know if they're considered repairable? With an investment like a plywood tank I think you always want to consider the repairability of the final layer. Like if you used a liquid rubber type product you could only go over and repair it with more of the same. You couldn't go back and go over it with fiberglass and any type of resin.
Likewise if your final coat is epoxy you can't go back over it with polyester. Epoxy bonds well to cured polyester better than polyester bonds to cured epoxy.
I read an excellent online article on gel coats in the past year or two but didn't save it. There were a lot more choices for gel coats than I was previously aware of.
Again, I don't think that top coating fiberglass and polyester is absolutely necessary. But I can certainly appreciate your wanting to do so. I only question putting down "gel coat" as a middle layer between your intial comosite layers and your final coats. Some gel coats are designed to have a low surface energy so they're easy to clean, etc. They may not allow for good adhesion of your final coats. Some gel coats are harder to repair than others, etc. Others are easier to buff out than others but "might" be more likely to blister. This is where you need to stop listening to me and start reading on your own.
But I will say that if you don't want to use a gel coat as a final coat then I'd consider skipping it altogether. Unless you read something where it actually ehances the bond to what you want to use as your final coat.
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
So in your opinion what do you think is the best steps... From plywood to finish?I have had bad experiences when top coating polyester with epoxies ( been in the fiberglass business professionally for nearly 26 years and have first hand experience mixing the types of resigns ) , I know all the literature says that epoxy sticks to polyester just fine..... only on well cured poly-ester.... and professionally I never mix the two If it made with polyester repair are either poly or vinyl ester.... anything below the waterline should be vinyl-ester and with that stuff it needs to be primed with vinyl-ester primer. I know epoxies are far more expensive but in the long run epoxies flex and stretch better the Esters do , I just believe that if price is not an issue total layup and top coat use some form of NON Blushing epoxy (which you can pigmented to the color of your choosing )Longevity and performance were key at the beginning of the thread and cost didn't matter....wants the best
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
I've built several tanks and boats, in fact, I started out in boats but was already a fish keeper. The gel coat youre referring to on boats Is an epoxy gel coat, they are designed to take pigment very well for a final waterproof 'painted look' coat..Also most have a higher UV exposure limit...
none of these are meant to be submerge there whole life span ..and most boat manufacture will tell you to seal the bottom if you plan on leaving it in the water for any length of timeIf this is true why is bath tubs, boats, pools and hot tubs jet skies wave runners all gel coat and fiberglass?
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
Ok @ any and everyone who has experience....what is your opinions oh which route I should go after framing and fiberglass.... Again i want top of the line product I do not care about how much per gallon or can it cost my interest is in the performance and longevity of the product... All wood shifts some over time and my design of my tank will keep flex and bow slim to non! So again as far as structure my design is great and flawless, I have no doubts there where I have concern is the final product to coat/seal the tank, it has to be 100% waterproof this cannot be rocket science, I am very good with fiberglassing I just have never used it for building a fish tank, so I'm asking all members who have experience with building tanks that have NO water leaks what so ever!!! What products they used I don't care if it's rubber...epoxy....kerdi membrain... Ect what I started this post for was to figure out from "experienced" monster Tank builders opinions on what not to do as far as products and why?????
If you've built a monster well over 500 please let me know what products you used for the build..... Thanks
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
If you've built a monster well over 500 please let me know what products you used for the build..... Thanks
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
Thanks,Permadri will bond to just about any surface including fiberglass. Most coatings will NOT however bond to it.
Has there been any issues with this product bonding to silicone to seal the window?
Sent from my iPhone using MonsterAquariaNetwork app
Just look into sweetwater epoxy sold on aquaticeco.com. I have had no fails with this brand-no leaks! 300 gallons is not 500 but I can tell you, I've made several tanks. Product should last 20 years with care. No recoating after a few years, no chipping, and no cracking. Used with fiberglass and your tank will be solid. I also mentioned its ability to bond with silicone very well.
