Questions to ask water Dept about water report

[Cardeater]

I was looking over my water quality report. It gives a number to call with any questions.

I recall from a previous thread, someone suggested to ask if they flush out the mains with higher levels of chlorine or chloramine and if they give notice of this? I think the thread says this is sometimes done after big storms or after water main repair?

My water is Lake Michigan water from Chicago that comes out the suburbs. Chlorine is listed (no mention of chloramine) 1ppm Chicago 0.9 here (I've tested 0.5 with strips but I'm on the fourth floor of a condo). I will ask if they ever use chloramine (on a future tank auto water change, I think I read here it's easier/cheaper to set up a system for only chlorine vs having to treat chloramine).

I've read people mention Nitrate and Nitrite tap levels. It says 0.3 ppm Nitrate detected in Chicago, NA for my city (I guess they don't test it?). Total Nitrate+Nitrite is also 0.3 ppm Chicago , NA my city.

The rest I don't think I've heard mentioned in threads here and I barely understand what they are reading the definition page. (HAAS, barium, etc levels).

Just to summarize, are there any other questions you would ask when calling? Only thing I can think of is what I listed above, asking about higher level flushes with chlorine and asking if chlormine is ever used here).

 

[duanes]

When I lived in WI, I also received Lake Michigan water, and worked at the water plant as a chemist/microbiologist.
Normal Chloramine residual there was between 1 and 2 ppm.

Natural nitrate level in Lake Michigan averages < 1 ppm (less than 1 part per million)
The nitrate level in finished water usually come from the ammonia that chloramine is made from, (chloramine is usually made with4 parts chlorine, to 1 part ammonia), and is also from beneficial bacteria living in the distribution system.

To me as a former chemist, that report (probably the same type as the one I generated) should be self explanatory, but I was fielded the fish related calls, being an aquarist. .
As far as main breaks go, all mains must be disinfected before being put back into service, so there is a chance that a slug of extra chlorine can push thru after being repaired. We in Milwaukee, always put notices on door knobs when an anomaly like a main break occured.

The mission of a water facility, is to provide safe drinking water for humans, protecting our fish, is up to we aquarists, and that often comes into conflict with what is safe for humans.

 

[tlindsey]

I was looking over my water quality report. It gives a number to call with any questions.

I recall from a previous thread, someone suggested to ask if they flush out the mains with higher levels of chlorine or chloramine and if they give notice of this? I think the thread says this is sometimes done after big storms or after water main repair?

My water is Lake Michigan water from Chicago that comes out the suburbs. Chlorine is listed (no mention of chloramine) 1ppm Chicago 0.9 here (I've tested 0.5 with strips but I'm on the fourth floor of a condo). I will ask if they ever use chloramine (on a future tank auto water change, I think I read here it's easier/cheaper to set up a system for only chlorine vs having to treat chloramine).

I've read people mention Nitrate and Nitrite tap levels. It says 0.3 ppm Nitrate detected in Chicago, NA for my city (I guess they don't test it?). Total Nitrate+Nitrite is also 0.3 ppm Chicago , NA my city.

The rest I don't think I've heard mentioned in threads here and I barely understand what they are reading the definition page. (HAAS, barium, etc levels).

Just to summarize, are there any other questions you would ask when calling? Only thing I can think of is what I listed above, asking about higher level flushes with chlorine and asking if chlormine is ever used here).

duanes

 

[Cardeater]

I'll have to call water department tomorrow. Person I was transferred to never answered

Water Hardness
I researched water hardness
for a few minutes. I had heard on various streams that Florida has hard water, Seattle area has soft (I've heard Cory mention this on Aquarium Co-op live streams many times). I was wondering how my water compares.

Google searches came up with Lake Michigan water being "moderately hard." Apparently the well water used to be harder. I remember this as we had a water soften in my old house down the street where we lived and didn't use it after the area got switched to Lake Michigan water in the late 80s.

This was an old Chicago Tribune article about water softeners and the hardness of water from wells vs Lake Michigan:

LAKE WATER MAY NOT END SUBURBS` HARD WATER BLUES

Q–Now that lake water has come to the northwest suburbs, do I need to keep my water softener? I`ve heard Chicago water is softer than well water, but is it soft enough? What about those commu…

www.chicagotribune.com

northwest suburban well water has about 15 grains per gallon; in Du Page County, it ranges from 18 to 25 grains per gallon; lake water is about 8 grains per gallon.

My old well water in town then was 2-3 times harder than current Lake Michigan water.

Another link provided this as the other unit seems to be what I could quickly find for other area of interest to me.

Chicago water typically ranges from 130 to 150 mg/L of calcium carbonate, or 7.6 to 8.8 grains per gallon.

I was curious what Lakeland, FL was is like as I have ordered a number of fish from Imperial Tropicals.

I got a 117 number from Google search for Lakeland so is pretty similar to what I have.

Since I always had heard Florida has really hard water, I did another search and I guess it depends where in FL. Miami area seemed to have among the highest:

Florida - HydroFLOW USA: Award Winning Water Treatment Devices

Home / Water Hardness Map / Florida Florida Water Quality in the State of Florida Florida water is controlled by the state government through five regional authorities: Northwest Florida water management district, Suwannee River water management district, St. Johns River water management...

www.hydroflow-usa.com

Floridan Aquifer yields well water hardness less than 180 PPM in Northwestern and Central Florida, providing moderately hard water to cities such as Tallahassee (126 PPM), Gainesville (140 PPM) and the theme park filled city of Orlando (129 PPM). Cities such as Miami, 219 PPM, and West Palm Beach, 317 PPM, have water that is considered very hard.

Now that I have seen actual numbers, I see how soft Seattle area water is in comparison. Redmond, WA, where Aquarium Co-op is, comes up at 30PPM or 1.8 grains, Seattle is 21.3PPM and 1.3 grains.

I'm not sure if there is any practical use for this info. Cory suggests you can get most fish acclimated to your water. I think someone made the point that if you order fish from somewhere with similar water, the fish may do better since they already adapted or grew up in that water. I guess this might be an argument to get fish from the LFS since they have acclimated to that water. (I've been mostly getting my fish from online retailers to skip the the fish being at a wholesaler and then the store).

I guess Imperial matches my water in terms of hardness.

I know many order from Wet Spot in Portland. Their water apparently is even softer than Seattle. Found this:

Is Portland's water soft or hard? Bull Run water—Portland's main water supply—is very soft. It typically has a total hardness of 3–8 parts per million (ppm), or ¼ to ½ a grain of hardness per gallon

 

[duanes]

Yes water can vary from city to city, even if they are only a couple miles apart.
My Lake Michigan Milwaukee water was moderately hard (7 grains, 7.8 pH), and was great for rift lake Africans, and Central Americans.
Much of the water a few miles west and north of Milwaukee is soft, and there are even black water areas.

 

[duanes]

Especially when you are dealing with continents water hardness varies tremendously.
Although in Africa, the rift lakes have very hard , high pH water, ....in much of west Africa where Pelvicachromis, and many jewel cichlids live, water is soft, and low pH.
Although one species of jewel (Rubricachromis exul, comes from Lake Turkana, considered one of the largest saline lakes in Africa.

In South America, rivers like the Rio Negro, and much of Amazonia have low pH and have soft water, and this is where many Geophagines, and other popular S Americans come from, ...... but.....
West of the Andes where (for example Andinoacara (GTs)), and Mesoheros come from, pH is often neutral and water is considered alkaline.
Then again, in southern Brazil, where the Geophagus braziliensus clade, and Gymnogeophagus come from, water is seasonally hard, higher pH, and the braziliensus group is even found in brackish water. estuaries.

 

[Stephen St.Clair]

When in doubt, be a good idea to go the worst case scenario route. Treat the water with a conditioner that neutralizes both chlorine & chloramine.
Another idea would be to contact your LFS and ask how their business deals with the local water.

 

[phreeflow]

When I lived in WI, I also received Lake Michigan water, and worked at the water plant as a chemist/microbiologist.
Normal Chloramine residual there was between 1 and 2 ppm.
View attachment 1526055
Natural nitrate level in Lake Michigan averages < 1 ppm (less than 1 part per million)
The nitrate level in finished water usually come from the ammonia that chloramine is made from, (chloramine is usually made with4 parts chlorine, to 1 part ammonia), and is also from beneficial bacteria living in the distribution system.

To me as a former chemist, that report (probably the same type as the one I generated) should be self explanatory, but I was fielded the fish related calls, being an aquarist. .
As far as main breaks go, all mains must be disinfected before being put back into service, so there is a chance that a slug of extra chlorine can push thru after being repaired. We in Milwaukee, always put notices on door knobs when an anomaly like a main break occured.

The mission of a water facility, is to provide safe drinking water for humans, protecting our fish, is up to we aquarists, and that often comes into conflict with what is safe for humans.

Hey Duanes, since you’re knowledgeable about this stuff, help me solve this mystery. Back when I lived in a different town, about twice a year, my water would get milky after a water change and as it cleared up, there would be white precipitate all over the gravel. My buddy owned a petstore and said it happened to him as well and that it was likely the water department adding something. Neither of us has ever figured out what it was. Fish did fine but it was a huge pain to clean up, especially for him. Any clue?

 

[duanes]

There are certain times a year, the water in the source changes due to climate, lake turnover or other seasonal factors. When this happens there is often a drastic change in pH, alkalinity, sometimes even hardness. When these phenomenon occur certain minerals precipitate out of the water column, and may manifest as white flakes.

 

[phreeflow]

There are certain times a year, the water in the source changes due to climate, lake turnover or other seasonal factors. When this happens there is often a change drastic change in pH, alkalinity, sometimes even hardness. When these phenomenon occur certain minerals precipitate out of the water column, and may manifest as white flakes.

Appreciate the answer. I’m shocked that the fish didn’t seem to mind such a drastic shift. Besides the water looking horrible and milky, my fish did fine. I don’t remember my friend taking any unusual losses at his LFS either. Amazing how adaptable fish are