Red Arowana bred in China?

[RD.]

china is not suited to breed tropical fish cheaply

Some of you need to get out more often.

China produces billions of tropical fish each year. Below is just one example of a farm that produces tens of millions of tropical fish each year.
http://www.qjfarm.com/Eng/index.asp


The Guangdong Province has humid tropical & subtropical weather, with short, mild, dry winters, and long, hot wet summers which allows year long outdoor & indoor breeding on a large scale basis. http://www.chinatoday.com/city/guangdong.htm

 

[Spiritofthesoul]

china has the wrong temperatures for starters. too cold, fish get sluggish.

I believe there is an invention called "heater"

 

[ausarow]

i havent come across info that they have been breeding asian red, and so far no one else seems to have. has anyone seen this other thread that says china has bred them or have we just gone past the claim?. if any other variety and i wouldnt bother reiterating it. Maybe if someone has bred them, its best for them not to say..hence why maybe it hasnt spread like wildfire. I mean you might only want to register with CITES if you wanted to produce a lot and export out.
Consider the sheer number of mature fish community tanks out there, in China and all over the place. does anyone know of tank breedings? and that reds are notoriously hard to breed outside of the equatorial area, even in ponds and especially harder if you venture a few degrees from the native areas. This shows how fine a line it is. Now what about the guys that have bred golds in China, have they succeeded with reds?
we heard about the golds, not yet reds and that was many years back. Sometimes even in the local areas with large numbers of mature fish with what you would think ideal conditions and large water volumes they have a lot of trouble. I cant think of a case of a red breeding in a tank at all. Heaters? yeah nice, plug in gets warm. i have heard of them too, people use them nearly every time with arows, in China sure, they already do. They tend to set them to the right temps too even if just to get best feeding growth response and it hasnt helped much yet in tanks.
i know of breeding events of greens and golds, rtgs. banjar reds ( the cross not pure yellow tail) being an exception but thats by crossing. an easier way out. Some people have experienced pairings with reds being one of the two, i doubt it being female though. many dont follow to term anyway.
You know all the half reds in the market? yep, males were the father reds.
the mother reds didnt come on.
Part of the problem, for reds especially so, is that normal hormone induction methods wont work as per ussual because a) the asian arowana wont as easily respond to an injection and spit out eggs a few days later because they do not so easily come up to that stage with their eggs compared to other species that people use hormones on. think protracted breeding times and activities..a pain in the R and D dollars unless your fish would likely be going to breed anyway given its conditions.
b) what about slow release, you go handling/injecting a fish/checking a fish for sex, you stress it out and it further will be hard to breed in an environment you are trying to get right.
ie how do you know its right if you might have done something wrong there. your environment is not likely to come and save things..
Other species have higher stress levels before stress blocks their breeding and they have less strict breeding requirements. This has evolved into them because of much change in seasons/water temps etc. arows are not one of them types. reason why? the equator. millions and millions of years at the equator. top order predator, if they bred easy and in big numbers, they would outrun a river. ease of breeding did not become a needed trait for survival, nor did young age for breeding nor did big batches. so you have a 140 odd million year old line that stood the test of time but did it slowly and had years of being able to breed the batch that had some fish that survived on. especially the case in a place where reds come from, arguably you could say they are more confined with less variation and they evolved to breed less than others ( their closer relatives) because they didnt need to, coupled with an even tighter need. i think this is the case with reds.

Even in the early days the local farmers had troubles breeding reds, when they did, they had low numbers offspring. Indoor breeding is being nutted out right now in SE Asia regardless. what it tells me is that when it is, and it is being done to some extent right now, China will jump right into it. Size of the park means they can produce more, but they have to produce some before it can be upscaled. The other thing thats worthy and behind the drive to success is that China loves its reds and it has showed in import percentages. Maybe this guy is right that there has been a breeding of red in china, the question would then be, but do they know why/can it be replicated with the pair and then can it be replicated with other non pairs. or is it more of a case that it was a numbers game and would eventually happen. the facts of that could determine the time it will take China to produce its first thousand. now if i was a rich chinese business man and wanted to breed reds, id go about buying known production pairs first and foremost.
others will make their money from easier species with quick turnarounds of small fish.

 

[RD.]

Well at least we have gone from mud bottom ponds being required, the temperature in China being wrong, to indoor breeding of reds being potentially possible. lol

china has the wrong temperatures for starters. too cold, fish get sluggish. not keen on breeding. i'll believe it after i see that they are breeding greens first. could be being done indoors with temps up and other things sorted out right too, its possible to breed in alaska like this so if someone wanted to throw enough money at it and knew it all then sure.

FYI - I was the guy that the OP was referring to, I mentioned China in another discussion that had to do with another species of fish that originate in West Kalimantan. Perhaps I spoke out of turn, and perhaps no one in China has yet to succeed in breeding reds in captivity, even still I wouldn't be so quick to rule it out.

The Chinese have been breeding fish for thousands of years, and I have no doubt that they will take what has been learned in Indo & S'pore over the past few decades, and apply it to their location & specific situation. Temperature will be the least of their worries.

Also, I'm not sure how the following comment has anything to do with a large scale commercial attempt at breeding aros, reds, or otherwise?

Consider the sheer number of mature fish community tanks out there, in China and all over the place. does anyone know of tank breedings?

Certainly there are plenty of mature reds out there, but how many of those reds have been kept in anything outside of a small glass box?
I've seen mature reds pair off, and exhibit pre-spawning behaviour, but that's typically as far as it goes in a glass box, even in very large glass boxes that exceed 500 gallons. The overall size & space of a tank/vat/pond is one portion of the equation, large mature brood stock is another part of the equation. I don't know of many people setting up 10,000+ gallon indoor vats, and stocking them with mature male/female red aros. Those sheer numbers that you spoke of simply don't exist.

It will be interesting to revisit this discussion 5-10 yrs from now, and see if the Chinese were/are able to successfully breed reds in any real numbers. I guess only time will tell.

 

[dayak]

Some of you need to get out more often.

China produces billions of tropical fish each year. Below is just one example of a farm that produces tens of millions of tropical fish each year.
http://www.qjfarm.com/Eng/index.asp


The Guangdong Province has humid tropical & subtropical weather, with short, mild, dry winters, and long, hot wet summers which allows year long outdoor & indoor breeding on a large scale basis. http://www.chinatoday.com/city/guangdong.htm

cool didnt know that..i always under impression china is dont have the tropical weather needs it, wondered if that farm can breed breed arowana, based on the fishes they mentioned..mostly are fish food and feeders

 

[RD.]

based on the fishes they mentioned..mostly are fish food and feeders

While it may not be the easiest website to navigate, they also show silver aros on that farm, along with many other non food/feeder tropical species of fish.

 

[dayak]

regardless that farm is pretty huge and i was just curious about arowana since this is arowana forum after all
do they breed the aro or is is just "holding" pond?

 

[ausarow]

I think it can be done too. thread went from saying how they are breeding them now to using china producing a heap of stuff as the only documented type way of backing it up. i saw no evidence of a fact of breeding in the articles only we seemed to be using chinas effort, ability and money/ size to support the claim. fair enough. tropical fish are not the same as a long time equatorial evolved species and thats why its much harder.

 

[RD.]

thread went from saying how they are breeding them now to using china producing a heap of stuff as the only documented type way of backing it up.

That's not at all why I posted that info. I did so simply to prove to certain naysaying posters that China has been breeding & raising tropical fish by the billions for many years. Moving a "pond" indoors is no large feat, and neither is controlling the indoor temperature of the enclosure. Those 2 points are what most people seemed to be fixating on, and both are a non issue. People do just that in far colder temperatures, even with equatorial species of fish.

 

[ausarow]

i understand where you were coming from now. sorry for confusing it.
dyak, we dont know for sure. nothing to say they are breeding those arows. silvers more than likely will be bred there comparitively easily.