Self priming 2000gph??

[takagari]

I am setting up my want with an overhead sump, so I plan to pull water from the tank, to the sump and overflow the sump back to the tank.

I am trying to find a pump I can mount on top of my tank, then run an intake line into the tank and pump up into the sump. But most I find are not self priming, or don't mention. I would rather not have the pump in the tank, for obvious reasons. And would prefer not to need to mount a bulkhead to put the pump beside the tank.

Would also prefer something fully controllable as well..

Any thoughts on which pumps would work for this? if any? or am I SOL?

Thank You

 

[DN328]

I dont have first hands experience with overhead sumps, but is the concept similar to HOB just larger scale? That is, intake from tank, filter with sump, then return/overflow back to tank.

I will tag along to this discussion. If your intake is essentially in the tank would self priming be an issue?

Edit: what if you placed the pump inside you overhead sump? Also, your best bet is to look at DC pumps. Jebao seems to be good value, but there are certainly other brands of DC pumps for flow control.

 

[takagari]

Yes, well mine will be beside the tank, but the top of the sump will be higher then the tank, overflows installed in the sump will gravity feed horizontally into the main tank.

I'm unsure if placing the pump in the sump would work. I think I would still need to prime the line. I was hoping to have it mounted at the top of the tank with a pvc pipe extended into the corner of the tank to "suck" the water from the tank to push it into the sump.

I'm looking at the dc pumps. may even go with one that offers a battery backup.

The priming is the issue. I could drill the primary tank, and place a bulkhead bellow the water line, but unsure I want to do this. would need to drain the tank etc. And plumbing/installing such a bulkhead would be a real pain in the ass....

 

[Drstrangelove]

Edit: what if you placed the pump inside you overhead sump?

I'm on the same page. Why can't the pump sit inside the sump with the inlet (to the pump) being a hose that extends to the tank, while the outlet (from the pump) will not have a hose and will simply empty into the sump?

You would be pulling up, not pushing up, but it might still work.

There would be no heat, self priming, noise or mounting issues. What I don't know is whether pumps would pull in water the same way as they push it out. Is it passive or active, and if active, is it the same force?

 

[DN328]

I run the Echotech L1 DC pump for my closed loop circulation and beleive they have a battery backup option from Echotech. It will be relatively pricey however.

If the intake for the pump extends and remains in the tank submerged I still don't see why priming would be an issue. Perhaps Im missing an issue to your point.

I can say if this works there is no reason why a DC pump would not work IN your sump. In fact you would then not need to plumb the pump outlet to sump as it's sitting inside the sump.

 

[DN328]

I'm on the same page. Why can't the pump sit inside the sump with the inlet (to the pump) being a hose that extends to the tank, while the outlet (from the pump) will not have a hose and will simply empty into the sump?

You would be pulling up, not pushing up, but it might still work.

Precisely doc.

 

[takagari]

Well the sump would be sitting above the tank, or at least this portion would. so it would still be sucking up from the tank. air in the line would stop the tank from pumping. As it won't remove the air and would cavitate

Assuming I could get the thing to work in such a manner. The first power outage would reverse the syphon on the pump and drain that portion of the sump back into the tank.

This would not overflow my tank, but it would empty the sump, once power restores I would have a pump sitting in a dry spot, attempting to suck water uphill again.

Does this make sense? A self priming pump can have air in the system and it does not matter where.
A none self priming pump will cavitate and be unable to suck water if any air int he line exists.

I may need to reach out to a few of the pump makers and ask specfically, as this seems to be a unique case...

 

[takagari]

Here's a quick sketch.
The plan is to pump up above tank into smaller tank which has chambers and filter floss to polish the water, as well as hold my heaters. it will then drain down an overflow pipe Or pipes, still working on that part. Into the bottom of a 35 gallon barrel which I plan to run a fluidized bed in.

in there I will have dual bulk heads that are meshed, and come out the side of the barrel, just above the rim of the tank, and poor back into the tank right at the water line.

In theory the only noisy part will be the first sumps drop. and possible the returns although I'm not to concerned.

But the pump needs to be able to suck up. I really do no want to install another bulk head just to ensure the pump is constantly primed

But it seems I may need to.

 

[millerkid519]

That will work if it only 4-6 inches above the water level. I have a set up similar to this and 90 percent of the time the pump will prime itself. When it doesn't want to cooperate with me and prime I use a power head blow it up the intake pump to start the pump. Yes I do understand that these pumps are ment to push water not draw it in but it has work for me for 2 years or so with weekly water changes

 

[Drstrangelove]

Would a foot valve not solve the problem of the pump not self priming? (Excluding the chance the foot valve fails, which is no small concern.)