So who told you that you can't breed koi at 20 inches? I guess the biggest farms all over the world are not breeding koi with there breeders that are all larger than 20+ inches. How about you make a phone call to some of these farms and and ask them how big there breeders are. I can tell you Hanover Koi, PA, his breeders range are large some close to 36 inches, black water creek FL his breeders are also 36 inches, smaller farm sundan koi in FL, his breeders are large 24 inch plus, so tell me why these people at these farms are you using such big fish to breed. You can find pictures also posted on the internet of some of these farms larger koi. The larger the fish, the more mature the fish is. Koi live for a long time, so a 20 inch fish is not old at all. 12 inches is very very very small for breeding, the fish is still going through a growth stage and maturing, just like humans goes through puberty. Also sexing a fish can be done by looking at the fins and body shape if it is a standard fin koi. People that have been around koi for a long time, are in the hobby for competion, or that just know koi and buy lots of them, can usually sex a fish as small as 6 inches, but it becomes alot easier when they are bigger like you said. But at 8 inches you can sex them and be about 80% correct if the fins are real nice and not beat up. Good luck on breeding them, and if you have breed koi before, i would like to see pictures of them and pics of the off spring.
should i breed these koi?
- Thread starter 4Andrew2Moore0
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So who told you that you can't breed koi at 20 inches? I guess the biggest farms all over the world are not breeding koi with there breeders that are all larger than 20+ inches. How about you make a phone call to some of these farms and and ask them how big there breeders are. I can tell you Hanover Koi, PA, his breeders range are large some close to 36 inches, black water creek FL his breeders are also 36 inches, smaller farm sundan koi in FL, his breeders are large 24 inch plus, so tell me why these people at these farms are you using such big fish to breed. You can find pictures also posted on the internet of some of these farms larger koi. The larger the fish, the more mature the fish is. Koi live for a long time, so a 20 inch fish is not old at all. 12 inches is very very very small for breeding, the fish is still going through a growth stage and maturing, just like humans goes through puberty. Also sexing a fish can be done by looking at the fins and body shape if it is a standard fin koi. People that have been around koi for a long time, are in the hobby for competion, or that just know koi and buy lots of them, can usually sex a fish as small as 6 inches, but it becomes alot easier when they are bigger like you said. But at 8 inches you can sex them and be about 80% correct if the fins are real nice and not beat up. Good luck on breeding them, and if you have breed koi before, i would like to see pictures of them and pics of the off spring.
Based on your post about they can't be 20" because of being old right there tells me just how amateur you are at this.
Koi mature at 3-4 years old, which if kept in a proper pond setting is 18-24". Hell, I had a Chagoi Female shipped from a koi farm that uses mud ponds, and at 8 months it was pushing 20". So don't try to act like big fish are old because it's simply not true.
My high quality koi are MUCH better than your koi, and many of the low quality koi that I keep. Note, the last 2 pics of my koi are low quality. As for an HD camera.. no, they were simply taken outside with an iphone. Don't try to justify the quality of your fish because of the picture.
They are pond grade. The same grade of koi that you can buy at petsmart.
I have been extensively working with koi for years now. I am a certified KHA (Koi Health Advisor) and part of that was learning how to sex a koi.
I have 4"-7" koi that I can sex no problem.
ThatFrontGuy makes a point, which you should check out.. Call Blackwater Creek Koi down in FL. Most of my fish even come from this farm.. their breeders are 30"+.
You asked if you should breed these.. should you? Personally? No. You can get better quality koi that will look much better, and will be easier to sell if you try down that path.
Can you breed these? No. They are both males, and they are not mature.
Post this on www.koiphen.com and they will tell you the same thing.
Koi mature at 3-4 years old, which if kept in a proper pond setting is 18-24". Hell, I had a Chagoi Female shipped from a koi farm that uses mud ponds, and at 8 months it was pushing 20". So don't try to act like big fish are old because it's simply not true.
My high quality koi are MUCH better than your koi, and many of the low quality koi that I keep. Note, the last 2 pics of my koi are low quality. As for an HD camera.. no, they were simply taken outside with an iphone. Don't try to justify the quality of your fish because of the picture.
They are pond grade. The same grade of koi that you can buy at petsmart.
I have been extensively working with koi for years now. I am a certified KHA (Koi Health Advisor) and part of that was learning how to sex a koi.
I have 4"-7" koi that I can sex no problem.
ThatFrontGuy makes a point, which you should check out.. Call Blackwater Creek Koi down in FL. Most of my fish even come from this farm.. their breeders are 30"+.
You asked if you should breed these.. should you? Personally? No. You can get better quality koi that will look much better, and will be easier to sell if you try down that path.
Can you breed these? No. They are both males, and they are not mature.
Post this on www.koiphen.com and they will tell you the same thing.
Started a small thread on our 2011 Koi Breeding Program as well as video uploads of culling process in the near future if anyone is inertested in seeing some of the process. I hope you attempt the koi breeding and find enjoyment in your journey! I'll follow this thread as well 
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/f...81-Koi-Enterprise-s-Koi-Breeding-Program-2011
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/f...81-Koi-Enterprise-s-Koi-Breeding-Program-2011
So you mean you only want opinions to support the decision you've already made for yourself, right? If so, why even post a thread? Just do what you're going to do and keep it to yourself if you can't handle honest OPINIONS. Mshills said your fish were low quality pond-grade fish. That is a FACT. If it hurt your feelings, that's your problem really. The pictures she posted ARE higher quality fish. If you can't see that, then you should spend more time looking at koi varieties and understanding what makes one fish better than the other.
For the record, I own several low quality pond-grade fish. I love them either way. They've bred before and produced some horrid looking mutts, but guess what. They're still in the pond I like them too. I'm not one to get offended if somebody's says their low quality, because I know what they are. Most were purchased for a couple bucks, not thousands like you'd pay for top quality fish.
