so if CITES is for endangered species...

[scriving]

see i told you wait for oddball

 

[deeboi]

deeboi: If you're referring to CITES Form A1-1 (2005/11/15) this is for Canada only.

The US FWS application OMB No. 1018-0093 requires an approved CITES permit before submitting the application. Permits will only be considered for a business, agency, organization, or institution directly related to the activity requested in the application. The Division of Management Authority (DMA) will NOT accept 'doing business as' for individuals. It must be a business or organization directly related to the species to be imported AND have proper licensing and permits to operate said business.

i could be wrong, but i think this is the one i came across...there's so many forms i'm not sure if this is the one i was reading the other nite...


http://www.fws.gov/forms/3-200-46.pdf

not trying to start a debate. as oddball i'm sure you have more experience and credibility on this than me by far..but i'm jus thinking the possibility after i stumbled on these the other nite..

also what if say a biology major, accredited, is there any more chance? lol..

 

[Oddball]

The problem with using form 3-200-46 (Type of Activity: Import/Export/Re-export of Personal Pets (CITES and/or Wild Bird Conservation Act)) is it also requires an already approved CERTIFICATE OF OWNERSHIP FOR PERSONALLY OWNED WILDLIFE "Pet passport" (CITES). That permit cannot be attained in the US for asian aros due to the constraints of the Endangered Species Act. Those constraints being that it is illegal to sell or possess asian aros in the US and its territories.

Simply put, you can't claim an animal to be a 'pet' if it is illegal to possess that animal by law. Trying to import an illegal species and claiming it to be a 'pet' still falls under the criminal activity of smuggling an endangered species.

 

[Oddball]

Claiming to be a biology major is fine. Provided the university is licensed for study of asian aros. Just be ready to provide a legitimate perspectus of the research to be done. The university must sign off on the research. Then, be prepared for a pre-inspection of the facilities to house the aros during the research program and routine inspections to verify compliance with the licenses.

 

[deeboi]

it doesn't sound like it's that strict as you describe. i mean all you need is the correct documents and then you get thru customs.

either way, what is the penalty of owning one, and or fine? have you heard of someone really doing time in a prison for owning ornamental fish? have you heard personally of a conviction regarding these fishes?

 

[deeboi]

CERTIFICATE OF OWNERSHIP FOR PERSONALLY OWNED WILDLIFE "Pet passport" (CITES).

is this the same as documentation they give you, or the certificate from the farm where they are breed?

still don't know this is for pet, how would or why would someone have a certificate to own a pet? isn't the Cites permit the" certificate of owned pet? it's for importing and traveling your pet thru countries..

so on this side, one would obtain the cites permit thru US fish and wild life, and in the country of origin, the certificate from the farm is the certificate of pet ownership?

also, from what i have read, these fishes were once legal to own here? so if it goes out of extinction, or off the endangered specie list, why wouldn't the policy be reversed?

isn't that the intention of the controlled farming in the country of origin, is to replenish the endangered population? i'm assuming, just because who knows they could be farming them for food, but that doesn't seem right if they selectively breed like that..

 

[Oddball]

isn't that the intention of the controlled farming in the country of origin, is to replenish the endangered population? i'm assuming, just because who knows they could be farming them for food, but that doesn't seem right if they selectively breed like that..

The problem is that there has yet to be a case of any farm doing any replenishing of wild populations.

 

[Oddball]

is this the same as documentation they give you, or the certificate from the farm where they are breed?

No. The forms I've listed are from the US gov't

 

[Oddball]

so on this side, one would obtain the cites permit thru US fish and wild life, and in the country of origin, the certificate from the farm is the certificate of pet ownership?

You need the Farm Certificate including chip registry, a CITES export permit from the gov't of the country of origin, and a permit from the US Gov't giving permission to import the animal. Of course, you also are required to have possession of all qualifying licenses and permits in order to get to the point of actually applying for the US permit.

 

[Oddball]

also, from what i have read, these fishes were once legal to own here? so if it goes out of extinction, or off the endangered specie list, why wouldn't the policy be reversed?

They used to be legal. I've owned quite a few of them back then. Their possession, sale, and importation became illegal once they were placed on the Endangered list. It stands to reason that they'll become legal again once their population rebounds and are placed in CITES Appendix III.