Sump intake question

[kdrun76]

Ok, here is where I sound like a moron. My overflow boxes can be rated for a flow rate?

This set up came with a pump that was 1200gph. I already owned the pump rated at 500gph. The two tanks getting sumps are 450 gallons and this 180. I decided to put the smaller pump on the smaller tank for obvious reasons.

I was planning to pair the 500gph with an XP3 and the 1200 is getting paired with an FX5 and an emperor 400. These give me a turn over rate of 4.7 and 4.9x an hour on each tank. I have other canisters I can use also if needed.

 

[jsodwi]

Are you still using the overflow box that it came with? Does it have 2- 1" pipes comin out of it, 1- 1" pipe coming out of it or 1 that is bigger than 1" If it is rated for 1200gph, I would personally get as much flow as possible out of it

 

[kdrun76]

Lets make sure I have the right names on things. The overflow box is the little square protrusion inside the tank that the water goes into before getting piped down to the wet /dry right?

If so... I have two of them, one on each side of the tank. They are part of the tank. Each of them as a 1" (ID) hose with a throttle valve that dumps into the wet/dry through a sock. I really couldn't even guess what these "boxes" are rated for...I didn't know they got rated.



I am looking into the reverse UGF right now. I honestly think I own the plates to do it. The plates fo rthe 70 gallon tanks that are in my basement, if turned sideways will probably be the right size. Does anyone else suggest I do that?

 

[kdrun76]

I have found the UGF plates I had in the basement. I have 4 plates that when put in the tank occupy all but 4" along one end. Not bad. The question is...do I want a RUGF?

 

[Pharaoh]

Lets make sure I have the right names on things. The overflow box is the little square protrusion inside the tank that the water goes into before getting piped down to the wet /dry right?

If so... I have two of them, one on each side of the tank. They are part of the tank. Each of them as a 1" (ID) hose with a throttle valve that dumps into the wet/dry through a sock. I really couldn't even guess what these "boxes" are rated for...I didn't know they got rated.

I am looking into the reverse UGF right now. I honestly think I own the plates to do it. The plates fo rthe 70 gallon tanks that are in my basement, if turned sideways will probably be the right size. Does anyone else suggest I do that?

Overflows are rated based on the maximum amount of flow that they can handle. In 99% of overflow, this is based off of the piping/plumbing as it has the smallest diameter. Flow will bottleneck at the smallest point. Each of your 1" lines should run at 600gph or so.

Your filter sock should do a decent job, but it probably wouldn't hurt to have an extra canister on the tank. I do not recommend drilling the overflows. I would just leave them be. If you do, you could potentially have water level with the piping being so low, especially with only running a 550gph pump.

At 550 gph, which would translate to about 400gph after head height, will be pretty low for that tank. It will definitely be too low for a UGJ system powered by the sump. You might look into eventually getting a bigger pump, but you should be ok.

Also, if you put sand it the tank, they are a bit easier to maintain.

 

[Pharaoh]

I have found the UGF plates I had in the basement. I have 4 plates that when put in the tank occupy all but 4" along one end. Not bad. The question is...do I want a RUGF?

You can use the filter plates if you have gravel. If you go sand, they are not an option. If you are going to add a power head to increase movement, look into under gravel jet systems. They are like a RUF, but operate a little differently.

 

[CA-Delta]

Come on Pharoah , share the wealth.
I have asked this question before to no avail.
What is the fundamental difference between a UGJ and a RUGF ?

Is this a RUGF or a series of UGJ's ? And why ?

Honestly, Im not trying to put you on the spot, I just never get a decent answer to this.

 

[kdrun76]

I was planning gravel, but right now anything is up for consideration.

A real flaw with a UGF of any variety is the monster that will live in the tank. I think he is Martha Stewert's biggest fan. He redecorates his tank twice a day. He can move more gravel in 24 hours than most well trained, over-caffeinated bull-dozer drivers.


The more I ponder, the more I think swimming pool filter sand and a power head is the way to go here.... I am also starting to think I am trying to fix something that isn't broken. I am just nervous about my first sump.

Maybe when I set the second one up in 2 weeks I will feel better?

 

[Pharaoh]

Come on Pharoah , share the wealth.
I have asked this question before to no avail.
What is the fundamental difference between a UGJ and a RUGF ?

Is this a RUGF or a series of UGJ's ? And why ?

Honestly, Im not trying to put you on the spot, I just never get a decent answer to this.

Basically, what you have pictured is a UGJ (Under Gravel Jet).

The only real difference between the two of them is the items that are used to make it and setups in which it will work effectively. I will explain.

First, an under gravel filter is a set up plates with uptake tubes, driven by air or by powerhead, that draw mulm through the substrate and down below the plates. So, in theory and RUGF (Reverse Under Gravel Filter), would be this exact setup with a reversed flow bias. **This setup can only work with gravel as a substrate.

Now, an UGJ (Under Gravel Jet) system is only setup using the reversed flow bias. It is typically made with PVC using a powerhead or water pump to flow water. **This setup would theoretically work with both sand and gravel substrates, but is typically used with sand.

Hope this makes sense.

 

[Pharaoh]

I was planning gravel, but right now anything is up for consideration.

A real flaw with a UGF of any variety is the monster that will live in the tank. I think he is Martha Stewert's biggest fan. He redecorates his tank twice a day. He can move more gravel in 24 hours than most well trained, over-caffeinated bull-dozer drivers.


The more I ponder, the more I think swimming pool filter sand and a power head is the way to go here.... I am also starting to think I am trying to fix something that isn't broken. I am just nervous about my first sump.

Maybe when I set the second one up in 2 weeks I will feel better?

I think this is the way to go in the long term.

For now, setup the tank with what you have. If the maintenance becomes too much of a chore or it too difficult, start looking into UGJ systems and designs.