Sump sizing for 220g?

[Toby_H]

The illustration below is my "favorite" sump design...

The better the water is 'mechanically filtered/ before it passes through bio media the less waste will clog the pores of the bio media... Therefore I suggest putting any/all/lots of mechanical filtration before the bio media. If you just 'filter out the big stuff' you are leaving all fo the little stuff to clog the little pores in the bio media...

I personally do not feel that Bio Media is 'needed' in typical set ups. Especially when a refugium is involved. If the tank is bare bottomed with no decor and heavily overstocked that may be another story...

You have not mentioned the size/quantity of your overflows. Without knowing the volume of water that your overflows can handle no real detail about the sump or sump size can be offered. But it would take A LOT of flow to be 'too much' flow for either of the sumps you are considering...

 

[Conner]

The illustration below is my "favorite" sump design...

The better the water is 'mechanically filtered/ before it passes through bio media the less waste will clog the pores of the bio media... Therefore I suggest putting any/all/lots of mechanical filtration before the bio media. If you just 'filter out the big stuff' you are leaving all fo the little stuff to clog the little pores in the bio media...

I personally do not feel that Bio Media is 'needed' in typical set ups. Especially when a refugium is involved. If the tank is bare bottomed with no decor and heavily overstocked that may be another story...

You have not mentioned the size/quantity of your overflows. Without knowing the volume of water that your overflows can handle no real detail about the sump or sump size can be offered. But it would take A LOT of flow to be 'too much' flow for either of the sumps you are considering...

In my sump design, there are 3 filter pads, followed by a 100 or 200 micron filter pad, all before the water enters the biomedia. So it should be more than filtered by the time it gets to the biomedia. I just have the sponges after the biomedia for some extra polishing (in case anything builds up in the biomedia and then gets dislodged). These sponges could be moved to after the fuge, to prevent anything from getting to the pump. That would still serve the same purpose.

The refugium will just hold extra water, and be a place for plants to grow and suck up nitrate. I may also raise the level of the refugium to hold more water, but I don't want it to be too high, or I might end up overflowing the sump when the power shuts off.

This tank will most likely have a 1-1.5" sand bottom, with some driftwood and rocks, but otherwise somewhat bare, as it will be home to rays and gars.

I haven't measured the overflows yet, but their are 2 overflows, and I think each pipe is between 1" and 1.25" diameter. I'll have to measure tonight to be sure though. There is a single return hose, it looks to be 3/4", but again, I'll have to measure.


I'm not looking for a crazy fast turnover rate through the sump, just 4-6 times per hour. I will also have a canister on this tank once its running.

 

[Conner]

Also, doesn't the sand restrict the flow of water through it? I would think it would end up compacting and water would just flow over the top of the glass?

 

[Toby_H]

Before I go any further, I’m not criticizing your filter design and it will work. I’m just sharing a bit on why I made some of the decisions I made in my design.
　
　
Having water come from the tank, into a chamber, then flowing through a series of sponges… allows the water to flow evenly through the entire sponge…
　
Stacking media as in your makes waste/debris “pile up” where the water first meets the top mechanical pad. The constant force of the water falling onto this one place risks eating away at the first layer of pad into the next. But the stacking/layering approach does save room…
　
　
The height of the refugium can vary based on details with little impact to the overall effects. Though changing it after the fact may not be so simple. By all means plan this in advance. Having enough space for ‘overflow’ when the pump is turned off is essential. I made that drawing as a 29 gal sump for a 30 gal tank so I didn’t need much space for ‘overflow’. Also decide on what kind of plants you want to use before committing to a refuge depth. If you use floating plants that need space above the surface you need some air space such as you have drawn. If you use submersed plants more water depth is needed.
　
I’m no pro with plants but have learned a few things researching for refuge plants. Fast growing plants generally consume more nutrients (including nitrates). Floating plants and other plants that stretch into the air commonly grow faster than submerged plants. But floating plants and other plants that stretch into the air also get more nutrients from photosynthesis and therefore rely less on less nutrients from the water. So I think in most cases these considerations balance the pros and cons between submerged and floating plants. While I’d like to do some form of comparison to ‘test’ which works better, if I just wanted to put it together so that it works, I’d use both…

 

[Toby_H]

Also, doesn't the sand restrict the flow of water through it? I would think it would end up compacting and water would just flow over the top of the glass?

The sand is a conseptional addition... I've yet to try it...

Also note this was designed as a 29 gal sump on a 30 gal tank... so the flow through this was meant to be fairly low...

Sorry, those are details that may prove critical...

 

[Conner]

I'm looking at either the Quiet One 5000 or 6000 for my pump. At 6' of head height, I would get:

QO 5000 = ~800gph
QO 6000 = ~1,000gph

Right now I'm leaning towards the 6000, just to give myself about 5x turnover rate with the sump.

The head height is actually likely to be closer to 5', so my gph should be a little higher than I listed above.

Then the canister will be about 350gph. I'll also have several powerheads in the tank positioned to blow any detritus towards the overflows.

 

[Conner]

The sand is a conseptional addition... I've yet to try it...

Also note this was designed as a 29 gal sump on a 30 gal tank... so the flow through this was meant to be fairly low...

Sorry, those are details that may prove critical...

Ok, I was just wondering. It seems like an interesting concept, if you could keep it from compacting. Basically a built in fluidized sand bed, right?

 

[Conner]

Before I go any further, I’m not criticizing your filter design and it will work. I’m just sharing a bit on why I made some of the decisions I made in my design.

No problem, no offense taken . I've learned to take people for their meaning, not the perceived criticism. I prefer to have people tell me if something is going to work, rather than say "interesting design, good luck with that".

 

[fox3]

I have gone thru a few different sump fuge designs now. I am not in favor of one path for water flow thru the sump anymore. I have settled on my current layout and this is the third improvement onnit and I am getting near zero nitrAte creep now after only two months using swords and wysteria. The best plants that I have used were coon tail and duck weed. I am not sure there are any better scrubbers out there and the fish love the excess growth. Prob is I am not fond of the maintenance of these plants and the constant fouling of my pump well.

What I have found to work is place the fuge to one side and only allow 3x or so flow thru it. Keep the pump well and bio chamber apart and let the pump divert some of the flow to the fuge which spills back into the bio chamber which flows into the pump well.

I have tried fuges with using the raw water from the display and got good results but then it gathers mulm which needs to be removed and I try not to disturb the flourite if not necessary.

I am not as good with paint programs but I will get to it and post a diagram shortly but inna nutshell ...

Divide up your sump in half or so. I have found a 15 gallon fuge to be suffecient for a heavily stocked african Happ tank. I tried 8 gallon fuge and got 20mg/l creep a week with 50% WC, not good.

Take the other half or so and divide it to allow for the largest pump well (to allow for evaporation) you can w/ out overflowing the display tank in case of overflow blockage leaving the larger remainder for drip tray and bio media.