The point of diminishing returns (bacteria)

[krabbo008]

I'm certain this question has been asked, but I can't seem to find an answer. At what point are you wasting space in your sump, canister or whatever it may be? I'm figuring there comes a point where you "bottom out?" Now of course I know more is better, but to what extent? Is there some sort of formula to this? × amount of surface area for bacteria to grow to × amount lbs of food/ammonia it can break down?
My situation is- 150 gal tank, aprox 40 gal sump. I have 5 gals bio balls and about 100 pot scrubbers. This will be a ray tank in the near future so I know I DO want to over-do-it, but what is the point of diminishing returns?

 

[Fish Tank Travis]

I'm certain this question has been asked, but I can't seem to find an answer. At what point are you wasting space in your sump, canister or whatever it may be? I'm figuring there comes a point where you "bottom out?" Now of course I know more is better, but to what extent? Is there some sort of formula to this? × amount of surface area for bacteria to grow to × amount lbs of food/ammonia it can break down?
My situation is- 150 gal tank, aprox 40 gal sump. I have 5 gals bio balls and about 100 pot scrubbers. This will be a ray tank in the near future so I know I DO want to over-do-it, but what is the point of diminishing returns?

You're planning on using your 150 as a ray tank?

As far as the bio media, I don't know exactly how much you need but I have heard many times that most people use WAY more than they need to.

 

[jaws7777]

I'm certain this question has been asked, but I can't seem to find an answer. At what point are you wasting space in your sump, canister or whatever it may be? I'm figuring there comes a point where you "bottom out?" Now of course I know more is better, but to what extent? Is there some sort of formula to this? × amount of surface area for bacteria to grow to × amount lbs of food/ammonia it can break down?
My situation is- 150 gal tank, aprox 40 gal sump. I have 5 gals bio balls and about 100 pot scrubbers. This will be a ray tank in the near future so I know I DO want to over-do-it, but what is the point of diminishing returns?

There probably is some formula but i think it would best to over do it especially when growing fish out. The bioload will change as the fish grow in my mind over doing it with bio media will ensure that your bb colony will have the surface area to grow with the bioload. Im sure someone will have a better interpretation though

 

[millerkid519]

My question is. Why are you spending money on rays when you should be upgrading first.

 

[krabbo008]

Look guys, I'm not some beginner. I know the requirements and I know this isn't a permanent tank. I have several large tanks already on standby. I appreciate your concerns and advice but it's really not needed.

 

[Drstrangelove]

So then you already know that no one can answer your question as to exactly where, when and how much is precisely too much bio media. There are 20 or more variables that go into the calculation of that answer and the variables are in constant flux. Moreover the values of many of the variables are unknown.

The reality for most people is that they do their best to make an informed guess what is needed and then they aim to err on the high side (not the low side.) The reason is obvious: having too much is a small cost, while having too little is an immense cost.

 

[millerkid519]

Look guys, I'm not some beginner. I know the requirements and I know this isn't a permanent tank. I have several large tanks already on standby. I appreciate your concerns and advice but it's really not needed.

Hey many sorry if I offended you. Just to many times we hear the same thing from beginners wanting to buy rays and put them in to small of a tank

 

[millerkid519]

It is hard to say. I have seen 3 mature bd stingrays with a sump that had 10g of bio balls run flawless. Me personally I have 25l of k1, 10g of bio balls and 7kg of bio home in one filter and about 600 pot scrubbies and 3kg of bio home in a trickle tower in another sump. It is overkill but my rays and setups are worth more to me then a little bit more money in bio media

 

[esoxlucius]

I'm doing an interesting little experiment at the minute and it's proving very surprising so far. I firmly believe that you don't actually need masses of bio media and my experiment is slowly proving me right. I used to have lots of bagged up bio balls and ceramics in my sump but over the past couple of months i've taken out a bag of bio every water change. The mid section of my sump is only half full now and it used to be packed. My water parameters are perfect. The reason i'm able to do this is simple. There's masses of BB throughout an aquarium and these colonies do just as good a job as sump BB colonies. I'm beginning to think that the BB in my mechanical side, as well as those throughout the rest of my tank (on glass, substrate, bogwood rocks etc etc) could cope with my bio load WITHOUT any bio filtration in my mid sump section at all!!!! How's that for a statement! However, this is MY experience with MY tank, MY feeding regime and MY stock. I would never suggest everyone try what i've done because it could be catastrophic with someone elses set up. As Drstrangelove said, too much bio costs little, too less could be an immense loss.

 

[joe jaskot]

Bacteria growth is limited by food source, oxygen, and water temperature. Not enough food and bacteria die. Not enough oxygen and bacteria die. Too cold and bacteria stop metabolizing waste. With that said, without adding more of a food source, adding additional filter media is non productive.