True green terror

[---XR---]

Gorgeus Fish!

 

[D-Train]

I ordered from spencer a while back on of these. they are gold saums and very nice ones to say the least.

 

[David R]

I am aware that a description for Aequidens rivulatus used an Ecuador-collected sample.

However, the 'true rivulatus' as we know it in the trade IS the smaller, faster and more aggressive riverine species found in the highlands north of Lima.

Interesting. So is there a different description for the "true" A. rivulatus from Peru, that differentiates it from the Ecuador fish and makes the old description of the species A. rivulatus redundant? Or is what is known in the trade as "true ruvulatus" actually not the true rivulatus because if differs from the Ecuador fish which is the type-locality for the description of the species A. rivulatus?

 

[Red_Terror]

Interesting. So is there a different description for the "true" A. rivulatus from Peru, that differentiates it from the Ecuador fish and makes the old description of the species A. rivulatus redundant? Or is what is known in the trade as "true ruvulatus" actually not the true rivulatus because if differs from the Ecuador fish which is the type-locality for the description of the species A. rivulatus?

From what I have heard there is a large debate as to which is true and which is not. From most of the places I have read aside from the occasional popping up of the guy who accounts of the equadorian fish being the true rivulatus, most everyone in the breeding field and the few people that are selling True ones refer to the Peru based fish. I have five of these and they are definitely different from the Gold Suam and Silver Suam which fairly justifys them as their own in my opinion. The two Suams have the same patterns aside from outer tipping colorations. The Aequidens Rivulatus from Peru has a reverse pattern from the other two with silver tippings, in other words instead of black spots on green it has green spots on black

 

[Tonivlc]

From what I have heard there is a large debate as to which is true and which is not. From most of the places I have read aside from the occasional popping up of the guy who accounts of the equadorian fish being the true rivulatus, most everyone in the breeding field and the few people that are selling True ones refer to the Peru based fish. I have five of these and they are definitely different from the Gold Suam and Silver Suam which fairly justifys them as their own in my opinion. The two Suams have the same patterns aside from outer tipping colorations. The Aequidens Rivulatus from Peru has a reverse pattern from the other two with silver tippings, in other words instead of black spots on green it has green spots on black

Hi, the true rivulatus its from ecuador, read this

http://www.lem.net/alf/aeq.htm

 

[Red_Terror]

Hi, the true rivulatus its from ecuador, read this

http://www.lem.net/alf/aeq.htm

hardly proves anything. Link has been brought up several times. The guy has no explanation for what the fish from peru is and he just says Günther described the fish. Considering both look extremely similar until I see the exact account from Günther I don't believe that the Silver Suams is the TGT.

http://www.discoverlife.org/mp/20o?search=Aequidens+rivulatus&guide=Fish here is one reference that disagrees and states Günther as the source. http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.php?id=12209 Fishbase says the same thing, and last time I contacted fishbase they had a very no decisive response. Also IMO rapps has been in the hobby long enough to know the difference between the two. I have no idea who Alf Stalsberg is, which is the writer of your said article. From a brief reading of his front page he states he is a pure hobbiest from norway(imo not the most reliable source for American cichild info) also at the bottom of the page you linked he clearly states "DISCLAIMER: Statements made on this page are not herewith made available for purpose of zoological nomenclature under the International Code of Zoological Nomenclature." which to me says he is unsure of what he writes and based on the international code what he writes isn't exactly correct. Hmm

That being said take everything I say with a grain of salt. I just happen to own one of each and still have yet to find a definitive explanation with solid facts, however I seem to find most people side with rapps

 

[Tonivlc]

Hello, you can are right but I think if you talk a lot of Rapps. But on the other hand I have not seen in any place that any ictiologist mentions species like siversuam, silversaum, redsaum, whitesaum, but Rapps yes.
To determine the name to these species, it is since ictiologist work many of the differences of these they are in their interior, the form and constitution of these. This undoubtedly on the outside are seemed, but that doesn't prove anything. For example the A. robertsoni, for my he doesn't have anything of the family Amphilophus and if he has of the family Thorichthys, however, if the fish of which we spoke outside this and I were Jeff Rapps neither any similar salesperson, it should place it where to my I looked like each other. Not you if this is this way, but neither I have seen it in any place, alone that I find that this gentleman puts name to species and he doesn't have because to make it, to be ictiologo is a lot but that to be a captor and salesperson.
Other problem is what the ictiologist, don´t have a public site where the put this things, but wherever I search it, the place where he describes this fish is in Ecuador. Stalsberg make this article and explain about it, but Rapps don´t make anything about it. Its possible that Rapps think the same thing. Sorry for my english

 

[hairdog]

I am getting four green terrors wild caught from ecuador. I know that true green terrors are from ecuador as the same for true red terrors(festae). I am not sure if the gold saums are from the same area. red terrors and green terrors were both collected originally at the same time thus similar names

 

[Red_Terror]

Hello, you can are right but I think if you talk a lot of Rapps. But on the other hand I have not seen in any place that any ictiologist mentions species like siversuam, silversaum, redsaum, whitesaum, but Rapps yes.
To determine the name to these species, it is since ictiologist work many of the differences of these they are in their interior, the form and constitution of these. This undoubtedly on the outside are seemed, but that doesn't prove anything. For example the A. robertsoni, for my he doesn't have anything of the family Amphilophus and if he has of the family Thorichthys, however, if the fish of which we spoke outside this and I were Jeff Rapps neither any similar salesperson, it should place it where to my I looked like each other. Not you if this is this way, but neither I have seen it in any place, alone that I find that this gentleman puts name to species and he doesn't have because to make it, to be ictiologo is a lot but that to be a captor and salesperson.
Other problem is what the ictiologist, don´t have a public site where the put this things, but wherever I search it, the place where he describes this fish is in Ecuador. Stalsberg make this article and explain about it, but Rapps don´t make anything about it. Its possible that Rapps think the same thing. Sorry for my english

Good point. I forgot about how he has some really bizarre classifications, that being said what do I call my fish from Peru? They're not silver saums and not gold saums...

 

[David R]

Interesting info guys, and just another reason why common manes annoy me. We're argueing over what is the "true green terror" when "green terror" is just a name given to a fish probably by someone who wanted to make it sound a bit more interesting and make it more likely to sell. Does anyone actually know which species the name "green terror" was first given to? Was it actually given to the true A. rivulatus and not to the much more common gold/silver saum? IMO its unlikely, the true "green terror" is probably a gold saum, because that has been much more common in the hobby which is where the name "green terror" almost certainly originated. What seems to have happened is that the gold saum has often been incorrectly named as A. rivulatus, and because the hobby unfortunately shuns Latin names in favour of meaningless common names the name "green terror" has become synonomous with the species name A. rivulatus and not with the fish it was originally given to. So when people talk about the "true green terror" what they mean and what they should really be saying is the "true Aequidens rivulatus", because the two are probably two different things.
In fact there is no such thing as a "true green terror" as there is no convention governing common names, so if I want to call my grumpy green severum a "green terror" then you can't tell me I'm wrong.