Why you should NEVER release any fish

[ewurm]

Well this is interesting isn't it? I'll have to parrot what poly says (he he that's kind of funny "parrot what poly says)....talking to a teen at the DNR can be rather amusing when the answer to your question is already written in the books. You can't do what they said you could. I'll bet if you contact a different person, you'll get a different answer.

Again I'm disturbed at the fact that you're willing to take not only a creature from an entirely different watershed (BTW the Florida panhandle is over 1800 river miles from central Ohio) and let it contact native fishes you fully intend to release into the wild. Not only is that animal 1800 river miles from you, it's been in the "pet industry" and who knows what that animal has picked up! This is unbelievable you could even consider such a thing.

I'll now just guess that you're a child with an above average vocabulary and hope you sit down and think about the written law and not listen to a minimum wage phone center attendant that works for the state. Best of luck to you and would love it if you'd not bother to spread this crap that spews from your mouth. Please do us all a favor and simply kill any fish that gets too big for you to keep. It's not you that will be harmed by a nasty introduction, it's us...those who care about the native fishes. You may not have any respect for the water or the fishes but could just have a little respect for maybe your fellow man.

I totally agree except that instead of killing fish you can't keep anymore, don't keep them in the first place.

 

[mjmc]

Dude.. sorry but I would not ask questions about specific wildlife law to some 18 year old temporary worker or intern at "wildlifeinfo"...That is not getting an authoritative answer to the question. I do not care what they say, what I'm telling you is directly from Ohio Wildlife law enforcement.

Mjmc I'm not a 13 year old that sits and plays on computers all day or keeps fish to amuse myself or masturbate my ego ... I actually work in the field of Native wildlife conservation as a professional. You would be wise to stop arguing with those that have much more standing, experience, and knowledge on this subject than you.

Thank you for your interpretation of the ORC. Let's see, if I were to be cited for this, who would I rather have defend me, an official representative of ODNR or an anonymous poster? "But your honor, polyterus' personal interpretation of "state waters" as used in the ORC is..." Forgive me for not taking you at your word, but perhaps you could further expand upon what it is exactly you do and for whom you work.

Pollution, overfishing, invasive species, habitat destruction...all these result in endangered species and all are caused by people.

You seem to focus solely on how humans cause animals to become endangered. Now I'm not the world's foremost expert on all things aquatic like polypterus, but I do believe I read sometime in third grade about one or two species that have become extinct long before Homo sapiens walked this earth. So why are all the endangered animals now exclusively the fault of humans? Some species' time may have simply come. Many here claim to have a great understanding of the natural world, and some I'm sure do. But to try and save every species when in fact their very species may have outlived its usefulness to their ecosystem. Now before you all attack me, I'm not saying that humans don't have a huge impact on the environment, most time to their detriment. But a blanket statement like that is irresponsible.

Again I'm disturbed at the fact that you're willing to take not only a creature from an entirely different watershed (BTW the Florida panhandle is over 1800 river miles from central Ohio) and let it contact native fishes you fully intend to release into the wild.

I never said one thing about releasing a turtle. I plan to keep the turtle for life. Although, the reason I wouldn’t release it is because it probably wouldn’t survive due to it being acclimated to a warmer environment, not due to phantom diseases found in every single aquarium in the continental US. I suggest you follow sandtiger’s advice earlier in this thread:

This forum is about "Coldwater, Temperate and North American native fishes" and this thread in particular is about releasing fishes both native and non-native back into the wild within North America…I suggest you stick to the topic at hand.

One thing that has bothered me in the last few responses I must comment on. I find it disturbing the subtle digs at ODNR employees (be they minimum wage or not) and it smacks of elitism. I have, in the past, found their email service to be very informed. The last question I had about a migratory bird law was answered promptly and with references. Perhaps you know who staffs these email responses and phone lines, but I don’t. I have had only positive experiences with them.

 

[teleost]

I never said one thing about releasing a turtle. I plan to keep the turtle for life. Although, the reason I wouldn’t release it is because it probably wouldn’t survive due to it being acclimated to a warmer environment, not due to phantom diseases found in every single aquarium in the continental US. I suggest you follow sandtiger’s advice earlier in this thread:

I know you have no plans to release the turtle but when you keep the fishes with the turtle it's the same as releasing the turtle. Disease can and will spread.

One thing that has bothered me in the last few responses I must comment on. I find it disturbing the subtle digs at ODNR employees (be they minimum wage or not) and it smacks of elitism. I have, in the past, found their email service to be very informed. The last question I had about a migratory bird law was answered promptly and with references. Perhaps you know who staffs these email responses and phone lines, but I don’t. I have had only positive experiences with them.

It's not a dig at the employees so please don't be so bothered. It's a simple case of entry level positions and nothing more. If you were at the dentist and required serious work, would you want the girl that answers the phone to perform the work would you? Or perhaps a better comparison would be: If you had a choice between a dentist that just got out of school or a dentist that has been practicing for many years, which would you choose? I'm saying the people that work in entry level positions are not the best qualified to answer sometimes complicated legal questions. I've had hilarious conversations with my DNR. I was once told basically every pet shop was violating the law. Elitist!? I find this particularly amusing coming from a guy that feels confident enough to try to tell an entire forum that it's okay to break the law by just calling (sending and email) to the state. I mean come on, you want to take fish home, put them in a tank that can't house them for life and simply break the law by releasing them once they've outgrown your accommodations. You want to convince people here this is acceptable behavior. I find this elitist but even more I find it selfish and ignorant.

To be honest with you I think you're not telling the truth about your conversation with ODNR. Why don't you try again but this time you can copy me on the initial message.

 

[Skipjack]

MJMC, you are clearly an intelligent person, well spoken, but you truly have zero common sense.
Polypterus,Sandtiger,Teleost, and others,we are flogging a dead horse here. No matter how much we argue with this fellow, he will continue to advocate the release of fish. Above he stated that he will not release his turtle simply because the climate is not right. He is too self righteous to even acknowledge any other concerns about the release of a non native turtle. Personally I plan to ignore MJMC, and all of his further posts. He is clearly way out in left field when it comes to responsible native fishkeeping. Honestly do you think he spends the time in the water like we do? Do you think he has ever pulled up an endangered species in his net, only to fumble around trying to snap a quick pic, because he is so worried about getting the fish back in the water with no harm done. Do you think he has seen a male zonatum dance, or the hooks on the vent of a male lamprey. How about the lunge that a stoneroller does as it scrapes algae off of a rock.
And we are letting this guy rent space in our heads? He is not of our set. We cannot expect much more out of him.

 

[mjmc]

teleost, if you don't believe me please copy and send the exact same email I sent to ODNR. If not, private message me your email address and I'll forward the email to you.

Skipjack, you are correct. I have not spent the time in the water that you obviously have. I have not witnessed any of that which you mention. I agree we have begun to beat a dead horse. In the immortal words of Ron Burgundy, "Agree to disagree."

 

[ewurm]

teleost, if you don't believe me please copy and send the exact same email I sent to ODNR. If not, private message me your email address and I'll forward the email to you.

Skipjack, you are correct. I have not spent the time in the water that you obviously have. I have not witnessed any of that which you mention. I agree we have begun to beat a dead horse. In the immortal words of Ron Burgundy, "Agree to disagree."

The point is that it PROBABLY will not be harmful to the ecosystem to release one specimen, but it MIGHT be. Enough said. If you do it, you will have broken state and probably federal laws and lost plenty of respect from your peers here. Do the right thing.

 

[X24]

i would say if a fish got too big for you to keep and nobody is willing to take it off of your hands...i would euthanize it. this can be done painlessly if you put the fish in a container with clove oil, then simply ad some sort of substance to poisen it.

 

[teleost]

teleost, if you don't believe me please copy and send the exact same email I sent to ODNR. If not, private message me your email address and I'll forward the email to you.

Skipjack, you are correct. I have not spent the time in the water that you obviously have. I have not witnessed any of that which you mention. I agree we have begun to beat a dead horse. In the immortal words of Ron Burgundy, "Agree to disagree."

mjmc,
Sorry for calling your credibility in question but I was able (through friends) to find rather quickly that your advice on the law is patently wrong. As if I needed to ask....The written law is perfectly clear on the issue.

PM sent

 

[teleost]

Thanks mjmc for the forward.

Sure enough the state said as he indicated.

Once again, sorry for calling your credibility into question.

 

[Skipjack]

I have learned with the Ohio DNR, that if you don't get the answer you want from one person, you can simply call another employee, and get a totally different answer. The trick is getting someone who specializes in aquaculture law. Many of the employees in a given district simply are not up on all the laws, and if they are not involved in enforcement, why should they be?
I fully believe that MJMC did get this response, but I also know it to be incorrect. Most DNR employees know the laws regarding sportfish, but few concern themselves with other species.
I got a different answer while on the phone with the fisheries division yesterday. I was told that fish may only be released in the same body of water on the same day. But I am not even sure that this info is 100% correct, or if it only one persons interpretation. I will spend more time in the upcoming week trying to track down a clear and concise answer to this.