lowest water temp for gars

[Wiggles92]

although likely holding true in several sets of circumstances, i would be wary of some of those generalizations. gator gars used to range into OH, so they probably can survive in "unheated settings of the upper 48" similarly to LNG, SNG, SPG.

FLG, although some evidence suggests their being somewhat more susceptible to cooler temps than other LEP-genus gars, can probably deal with cooler temps as well - they have been introduced in Canada and other upper states.

again, although likely holding true in most circumstances, the natural range correlation can be plastic--
--solomon

Yes, I did generalize quite a bit. I wanted to avoid saying that certain gars would be fine in certain situations only to have someone try it and have the gar end up dead, so I stuck with current natural ranges instead of including historical and introduced ranges (didn't know about the successful Florida gar introduction this far north).

Hmm... I may just have to see how my new Florida gar will hold up in my pond then when spring comes around.

 

[E_americanus]

Yes, I did generalize quite a bit. I wanted to avoid saying that certain gars would be fine in certain situations only to have someone try it and have the gar end up dead, so I stuck with current natural ranges instead of including historical and introduced ranges (didn't know about the successful Florida gar introduction this far north).

Hmm... I may just have to see how my new Florida gar will hold up in my pond then when spring comes around.

- introduced range info isn't terribly important in this thread, however, it does play a part in avoiding too much generalization.

- historical range, however, still counts, as the fish naturally existed in those temp regimes and therefore could play a part in current temp tolerance ranges of the species.

i definitely understand not going too crazy with info just in case people misinterpret or try something that isn't best for the fishes, at the same time, broad generalizations will get people into trouble as well.

all that being said, i would assume the OP has his answers now --
--solomon

 

[pharmaecopia]

- introduced range info isn't terribly important in this thread, however, it does play a part in avoiding too much generalization.

- historical range, however, still counts, as the fish naturally existed in those temp regimes and therefore could play a part in current temp tolerance ranges of the species.

i definitely understand not going too crazy with info just in case people misinterpret or try something that isn't best for the fishes, at the same time, broad generalizations will get people into trouble as well.

all that being said, i would assume the OP has his answers now --
--solomon

From another thread that was related to temperature range for alligator gar it was mentioned that the origin of the original stock should be taken into consideration. I think the example was fish aquacultured in mexico would probably not fare as well at the lower ranges as ones that were from more northern stock. So for a species that had a large range shouldn't you stick to the upper ranges unless knowing the collection point or history of the fish?

 

[E_americanus]

From another thread that was related to temperature range for alligator gar it was mentioned that the origin of the original stock should be taken into consideration. I think the example was fish aquacultured in mexico would probably not fare as well at the lower ranges as ones that were from more northern stock. So for a species that had a large range shouldn't you stick to the upper ranges unless knowing the collection point or history of the fish?

this is definitely a dynamic issue when it comes to gars and i am glad you brought it up (some of my current research deals with this sort of latitudinal variation question). stocks from warmer climates would do best in warmer climates, and stocks from the more northern latitudes should outperform at all temps (this is not the case with all fishes, but does appear to be the case in some gar species, and likely could be extrapolated to other temperate gars).

that being said, those differences in tolerances are largely negligible unless one is keeping them outside in a pond and talking about freezing. this also brings into question the amount of detail appropriate in answering the OP's question...too much generalization can be a problem, and too much resolution (latitudinal variation details) can be practically (in terms of home aquaria) irrelevant.

that's one of the challenges with answering questions on a fish forum that primarily focuses on the hobby...there are practical answers for hobbyists (which ryan was getting at with his second set of comments) and there are science answers which definitely expound upon fish biology/ecology, but in reality won't play a huge role for the hobbyist.

now we can also take into account that gators are being cultured quite a bit in Asia...since we don't have all the details as to exactly where...that could be an issue too. again, unless you're trying to keep them outside in a place where it may freeze, 65-85F is the best temp range (indoors or outdoors if you can control it) --
--solomon

 

[screaminleeman]

although likely holding true in several sets of circumstances, i would be wary of some of those generalizations. gator gars used to range into OH, so they probably can survive in "unheated settings of the upper 48" similarly to LNG, SNG, SPG.

FLG, although some evidence suggests their being somewhat more susceptible to cooler temps than other LEP-genus gars, can probably deal with cooler temps as well - they have been introduced in Canada and other upper states.

again, although likely holding true in most circumstances, the natural range correlation can be plastic--
--solomon

I will be testing the Florida Gar eventually in an outdoor spring fed farm pond. Possibly this year.

I was considering the addition in mid to late spring rather than summer though. Especially from a natural pond with existing food species present!

My thoughts were to #1 get the gar into the pond well before the water temperature reached it's yearly max! This will allow the gar to experience the slow natural warming of the water in the summer. My thought set was that possibly the gar would be more easily able to instinctively "view" the change in temperature as "cyclical" rather than just heading toward lethal cold.

#2 I would give the Gars as much time as possible to become adapt at hunting for their wild prey. The pond is ~ 100 feet across and with a full contingent of wild Bluegills, Crayfish, Tadpoles, Frogs, Minnows (and even some 14 - 16" pond comets) I may very well never get to hand feed my babies again. That's OK though because I know they have a limitless food supply if they can catch it!

 

[scriving]

Great info guys all of my questions have been answered whenever I ask questions in the gar forum questions are answered i just wish the rest of mfk would be like this.

 

[Polypterus]

this is definitely a dynamic issue when it comes to gars and i am glad you brought it up (some of my current research deals with this sort of latitudinal variation question). stocks from warmer climates would do best in warmer climates, and stocks from the more northern latitudes should outperform at all temps (this is not the case with all fishes, but does appear to be the case in some gar species, and likely could be extrapolated to other temperate gars).

that being said, those differences in tolerances are largely negligible unless one is keeping them outside in a pond and talking about freezing. this also brings into question the amount of detail appropriate in answering the OP's question...too much generalization can be a problem, and too much resolution (latitudinal variation details) can be practically (in terms of home aquaria) irrelevant.

that's one of the challenges with answering questions on a fish forum that primarily focuses on the hobby...there are practical answers for hobbyists (which ryan was getting at with his second set of comments) and there are science answers which definitely expound upon fish biology/ecology, but in reality won't play a huge role for the hobbyist.

now we can also take into account that gators are being cultured quite a bit in Asia...since we don't have all the details as to exactly where...that could be an issue too. again, unless you're trying to keep them outside in a place where it may freeze, 65-85F is the best temp range (indoors or outdoors if you can control it) --
--solomon

The answer Mr. Trebeck is "Why did Peje not say anything in this thread thus far"

Now I'll take Extent to which species differences are adaptive for $300.

 

[E_americanus]

The answer Mr. Trebeck is "Why did Peje not say anything in this thread thus far"

Now I'll take Extent to which species differences are adaptive for $300.

whoa whoa whoa...$300??? more like $10,000+/Daily Double/and 3+ years

 

[calabturner]

spotted, and long nose gar can survive in cold conditions. My gar tank At this time is only 60 degrees and they are doing fine. just be carful of what specie you have.

 

[E_americanus]

spotted, and long nose gar can survive in cold conditions. My gar tank At this time is only 60 degrees and they are doing fine. just be carful of what specie you have.

with adults, yes, with YOY it is questionable and depends on their upbringing...hence all the discussion thus far as it is not a simple set of answers.--
--solomon