Are rays better off in high ph/tds waters

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
Toby you speak of lateral line erosion if you keep fish in pure water, Due to lack of calcium. You do realize the calcium content of the river during certian seasons is almost nothing or probably is nothing. They do ingest calcium from their preys such as fush bones,shelled fish ect..do you have anything that can prove this to be true or is it based on speculation or because somebody's fish got sick and they diagnosed them with lateral line erosion because of their ro? I really would love to see some hard evidence proving this not just arguments . Do you have any links or hood reads you can share with buddie
 
HEY DW

what time of year were those measurements of Tocantins river taken? Rainy or dry season ect.. I can't read through this whole thread my brain my brain....
 
calgaryflames said:
HEY DW

what time of year were those measurements of Tocantins river taken? Rainy or dry season ect.. I can't read through this whole thread my brain my brain....
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I am not sure, but not the wet season almost certainly, as no-one really goes anywhere during that time, so it is possible to surmise that those numbers I gave you earlier are from a relatively low water time, meaning they are at the higher end of their spectrum.
I took them from a book called 'Adventures with Discus" by Hans Mayland
He provides chemical analysis of maybe 15 different Amazon tributaries.
When i was there i did a few pH and uS readings only.
The highest uS I got anywhere , from Tefe down to the Xingu, was uS 14, which is about what an R/O unit will produce.
 
calgaryflames said:
Toby you speak of lateral line erosion if you keep fish in pure water, Due to lack of calcium. You do realize the calcium content of the river during certian seasons is almost nothing or probably is nothing. They do ingest calcium from their preys such as fush bones,shelled fish ect..do you have anything that can prove this to be true or is it based on speculation or because somebody's fish got sick and they diagnosed them with lateral line erosion because of their ro? I really would love to see some hard evidence proving this not just arguments . Do you have any links or hood reads you can share with buddie
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I did not say the lack of calcium lead to lateral line erosion, I said the use of RO had lead to lateral line erosion...I.e. not just calcium!

I thought this was common knowledge but have attached a good link for starters. I think you missed my point a little....RO straight has proven to lead to lateral line erosion in many species of fish (in fact too soft water lacking in essential minerals) not specific to any species therefore the amazon may be lacking at certain times (not seen proof but assume you got that from somewhere). Almost nothing is very different to nothing, especially for prolonged periods, not just times of year.

http://www.aquarium-pond-answers.com/2006/12/how-do-fish-drink.html#correct_ro

Interesting points about domestic water softeners too! Have a search around as there is a paper on there specific to lateral line erosion too...will post link


In your other post you started talking about adding coral gravel and that it doesn't last long....this is due to the calcium being stripped out of it....you do realise the irony of this as you are contradicting your own arguments?
 
This article is on the dangers of humans drinking RO....I did not know it could give you arthritis and then kill you. Please do not say that rays are not humans....

The point being that the us health agency quoted in the articles stated how aggressive the water is by taking in any minerals and stripping metals out of the host trying to re-mineralise itself...It will strip this out of decor, substrate and our fish! (I met some guys who run an lfs and they only drink RO at the shop...they need to see this)

http://www.snyderhealth.com/water_ionizers/distilled_and_reverse_osmosis_water.html

I mentioned before that you should aerate for at least an hour before use....lack of oxygen is one of the lateral line erosion protagonists too.
 
Toby theirs more minerals in the rays food than they Osborb. You are misunderstanding . One can almost find anything he wants online just type in anything on google . Anyways in previous posts you've mentioned to me lack of calcium causes that and this one whack doctor thinks that? Theirs also many doctors that think you will live longer from drinking ro water. I do not use a deionoizer on my ros . No need.my uS is about 10-20 coming out of my ro. The highest youl find in the amazon.
Any ways you have success at what you've been doing that's awsome man. A friend of mine here gets his tiger breeding in a Tds of 600 and ph over 8 .
 
And what benifical minerals could possibly be in my high altitude mountain water that my rays need?
 
DB junkie said:
So you drip straight RO in your tank? Or mix back some tap water with it? Can you tell us more about the RO (stages)? Are you using anything to remineralize it like DI resin? Or is it just straight RO with coral gravel?
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DB i drip RO into the sump where it is well airated before it goes into the main tank. I use 3 pond plant baskets full of coral gravel to buffer the water to 6.5 and change it every 4 months because it does break down as the RO strips it of the calcium. When i first add new coral gravel i wash it thoroughly to remove debris ect, after 4 months you actually see the level of the gravel drops by about an inch. When i remove a basket to replace the gravel there is a big cloud of coral dust and this shows how much the RO breaks it down.



Just Toby said:
This article is on the dangers of humans drinking RO....I did not know it could give you arthritis and then kill you. Please do not say that rays are not humans....

The point being that the us health agency quoted in the articles stated how aggressive the water is by taking in any minerals and stripping metals out of the host trying to re-mineralise itself...It will strip this out of decor, substrate and our fish! (I met some guys who run an lfs and they only drink RO at the shop...they need to see this)
I mentioned before that you should aerate for at least an hour before use....lack of oxygen is one of the lateral line erosion protagonists too.
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This is why i airate my tank so much and use so much coral gravel in the sump. RO in its raw form is deffo toxic to humans and even if remineralised it is still harmfull to us because it still lacks certain minerals that are added by the local water authority.

There are specialised units that are made for drinking purposes and only these should be used. WARNING...DO NOT DRINK RO WATER... it will make you very ill and could potentially kill you. You've been warned.

When you set up an RO unit there is a membrane that contains toxic chemicals and you must flush your RO unit for a couple of hours before you start dripping into your tanks otherwise you will end up killing whatever fish you are keeping.
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I've been drinking my ro water for a whole while now same with my wife brother and son. We get minerals in our foods.

Maybe I'm drinking to much ro water .thats my problem lol
 
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