Why no large UNFADED bp?

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Nice question Crush. I too have wondered the same thing but never got any answers because RT breeders are very tight lipped about that kind of stuff.

Thanks Onefowl1 for breaking it down. It gives me hope for my line. I'm only on my 2nd gen but my line has fertile faded males so it should make my job a little easier in getting a higher percentage of faders.

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That's the thing Gutted... you can keep getting higher and higher %'s but you should never reach 100% faders from your project... so how do ALL bp's fade.That's the part that this whole thread is about... Maybe the syn has a recessive fading gene.

I have only bred bp with texas and I can say that cross does not give you no where near 50% faders so a bp is obviously not what you are talking about.
So Onefowl1 your saying with the right line bred fish you can breed a fader to a non fader and get more than 50% faders on the initial cross? How about this new rd with a non fader(texas)? I'm thinking 50% will fade but their color will be richer than a regular orange rd.

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Try to X that RD to a female parrot.

Man great colrs he's a keeper
 
Thats a really nice red devil

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Thank you
Try to X that RD to a female parrot.

Man great colrs he's a keeper
Thanks. I would breed it(yes hopefully a male) to a bp(hopefully it's a female) that I bought at the same time. But I also got red mammons I'm growing out... so if the rd is a male then I'm good to go.
First 3 pics are of bp and last 2 are one of my red mammon grow outs... I am pretty sure it's a female. They all need time to grow and mature...

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at the very start of the video you will see an offspring male from Midevil male X Blood parrot female. He's the orange fader with black blotches.
There were about 5 short bodies in the batch of around 300.

[video=youtube;leg_jswUFAo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leg_jswUFAo[/video]

found his old thread
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?433862-Gray-Guy-fading-4-4-5-inch

Yeah he was nice. I responded to you on that thread. Lol
I raised one similar from a bp/texas spawn.
First 2 pics are of the fish that was similar to yours. Last pic is a 3rd option for the rd... an all white amph.

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Yes Crush you can as long as the fading gene fish carries the full set of the gene. Only half a set of the gene is needed to express itself. With this kind of cross it is possible for all to fade but more likely a good many will fade slowly over time and some will carry the gene but not fade.
As to the color that is a different can of worms. With the fading gene it is straightforward on how it is transferred but color is not always so. First it would depend on the non fading fishes base color genes and where in the dominance chart they are compared to the fading fishes genes. So besides the fading gene there are color genes, pattern genes and refraction genes that affect how our eyes perceive a fish looks. Reptiles with scales have refraction genes too. They are a thin layer of clearish cells that affects how light reflects off them. An easy example of this is how a fish can look like they have a green or blue sheen but when they turn or move into a different angle they are silver. This is harder to see on colored fish. So when trying to figure what your offspring will grow out like there literally are hundreds of possible combinations some very similar and others quite different.
I keep seeing people who do these crosses say only a few fade and most do not. I do not believe these people have really given the bulk of the fry a fair amount of time to truly say this. More likely what is the truth is only a few faded before they dumped them out of lack of space to house them. I understand this and try and keep the ones who fade fastest in an attempt to produce a faster fading line of fish. I have had rd and midas grow to over 7 inches and be over a yr old before fading. I have a female rt that for the first three spawns was a non fader start to fade after this last batch of fry. Members on this forum have had fish several yrs old before finally start the fading process and have pictures to prove it. So how can someone say that less than 50% of their crossed fry faded only raising them to an inch or two? A more correct statement would be less than 50% faded before they reached a couple inches.
 
Another thing that proves what I am saying about the fading gene is that if you can breed any fader rather a full set of the gene or half to a known non carrying for the gene fish and get even one fry that fades that it only takes half a dose to express. So with albino for example unless both parents carry the gene or half of the gene it can not express itself first generation.
If you breed a fish with a full set for fading to a fish that does not carry the gene the fry all carry 50% of the gene rather they express it or not. If you cross two of these fry that express the fading gene it is possible to produce fry that carry a 100% or full dose for it. There is no such thing as 75% or 66% as the gene does not work that way. These terms are used more often to classify the fish as a whole or for genes work differently in the order of dominance. For and example if you bred texas x red devil together and produced a fish it would be 50% for each species. If you bred that fish back to a pure texas the fry would be 75% texas 25% rd on paper but might not be in reality. These percentages are based on the probability of them being combined right to express themselves.
 
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