Does overstocking work in CA?

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Usually in pet shops, they look on the verge of death and/or diseased a large majority of the time, hence why they aren't even able to display their natural aggression.

Also, a lot of lfs run plumbed systems with massive sumps and water through a larger system, therefore avoiding the problems with filtration that we would experience in the average home set up
 
Yes, you can crowd CAs just like Africans, but you need disproportionally much larger space not only because CAs are bigger fish, but they also form pair bonds that stake out fixed territories. Mouthbrooding Africans do not need as much space as they are constantly moving and staking out shifting territories. For large Red Devil size CAs, you need 300+ gal tank just to keep a few pairs. Look at this crowded Red Devil tank in Shedd Aquairum. There appears to be little aggression and no shreded fins in a 500-1000 gal tank.

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RD. said:
No females, no pair bonds to worry about - another successful way in which to keep aggro fish under control in a glass box. All male set ups.



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But it still wouldnt have a chance in a 4' tank?

If i was to do this (again; i like the idea but i more than likely wont do it) and i did it with more peaceful species, say, a male FM, an O, a male Blue Acara, and a Sev, as these arent overly aggressive species, and only the O gets very big, could it work? In a 4' tank?

Obviously with fish like Amphs or Veija the aggression levels are higher and its less likely to succeed, right?
 
As far as community tanks go, there are never any guarantees.
 
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RD. said:
No females, no pair bonds to worry about - another successful way in which to keep aggro fish under control in a glass box. All male set ups.
No Women. No Cry ...... Bob Marley & the Wailers
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That would work not just with CAs, but also with mouthbrooding Africans. But by eliminating breeding aggression, you also eliminate the fun to observe paring behavior. What makes CAs interesting is that many form inseparable bonds like lovers even in between breeding. Mouthbrooders don't bond so there isn't much to lose by not having females.
 
Not everyone is interested in keeping large cichlids that produce hundreds of fry on a continuous basis. Not to mention many CA males will constantly harass or outright kill the female when forced together in the small confines of a glass box. For every successful long term couple, there is a long list of dead fish.

The OP wasn't asking about breeding CA cichlids, he was asking about successfully keeping a group together and the chances for long term success. Clearly it can work, just check out Buddy's tank linked to above. The debate pretty much ends right there. lol
 
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duanes said:
A friend on mine had/has (haven't seen it in a year), a tank with 2 pair of festae(males 10" females 6"), some carpintus (@7"), and about 8 African mbuna @7"). It is a 200gal+, with a large sump, and is almost unbelievably calm. If I hadn't seen it myself I might not believe it. All the fish grew up together, and were added as 2" juvies at the same time.
He watches the tank like a hawk though, and removes, and adds back fish if the dynamic changes, to tanks always set up, and at the ready.
I have also had temporary set ups like this, but they seldom last.
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That's a key with tricky combinations ime, assuming a large enough tank in the first place. There are a lot of sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't scenarios in the hobby, also some normally won't work but occasionally it does scenarios. Keeping an eye on things while having an understanding and feel for fish behavior and then having enough tanks/tank space to make a change when the signs and hints are there but before something bad actually happens can improve the odds-- beyond that it's always up to the individual fish.

Another observation-- you can't predict eventual adult behavior based on a tank with small juvies in it, things can change fast with some size and/or approaching sexual maturity. There's also a fair share of I don't get it, they were fine together for the past x number of years, then suddenly one day... stories out there.
 
I'll work just fine as long as you stay on top of it because it can get out of hand very quickly. Before hand you need to know what are males and females, some of the smaller fish like a convict can be ok to have a pair in a large tank but not most others. Over the past several months I now know what are male and female and have all of them separated except for one tank which is a 210 and there are a pair of Chocolate cichlids. In the 265 which I have two of, I had a male RTM breed with a Freddy and they had all the fish on one side of the tank, hated that. So I split them up and all went back to normal after a few days. Here is my tank with Midas, aggression was at the minimum and worked out good. But I have since sold all my 3 of the Midas I caught from Florida this year. It's good to have multiple tanks so you can separate fish that don't get a long or you can just sell/trade for another as all fish have different personalities.

 
JasonGoneFishing said:
I'll work just fine as long as you stay on top of it because it can get out of hand very quickly. Before hand you need to know what are males and females, some of the smaller fish like a convict can be ok to have a pair in a large tank but not most others. Over the past several months I now know what are male and female and have all of them separated except for one tank which is a 210 and there are a pair of Chocolate cichlids. In the 265 which I have two of, I had a male RTM breed with a Freddy and they had all the fish on one side of the tank, hated that. So I split them up and all went back to normal after a few days. Here is my tank with Midas, aggression was at the minimum and worked out good. But I have since sold all my 3 of the Midas I caught from Florida this year. It's good to have multiple tanks so you can separate fish that don't get a long or you can just sell/trade for another as all fish have different personalities.

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Yes, it's a beautiful CA tank and the strategy works, but it's a 265. Any tank smaller probably won't work with highly aggressive Midas species. But there are many more tolerant and smaller CA/SAs that can be kept in smaller tanks in breeding pairs. It's the choice of species that makes it break or work.

Jim Cummings posts regularly on his CA/SA community tanks, often with breeding pairs in the mix and it works because he keeps mostly tolerant species.

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/f...-the-world-of-south-american-cichlids.592232/
 
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