How has the coronavirus affected your personal life?

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Hello; I am having a similar discussion about the virus on a different forum. One fellow has been talking about the non-sterilizing nature of the new vaccines. I finally did some searching to see what he has been trying to say. Some things seem to have clicked into place after reading some links. For example how can a vaccinated person can have a nasal viral load the same or greater than an unvaccinated sick person. I get it much better. Here are some links, but there are plenty of others. I also add a copy of the post I made in the other site. I still have questions.

COVID-19 Vaccines and Sterilizing Immunity: Goals and Progress (verywellhealth.com)



EUA “vaccines” are non-sterilizing. | Welcome to my Pandemic Hobby Blog (macryan.com)



Coronavirus: few vaccines prevent infection – here's why that's not a problem (theconversation.com)



Hello; Three links with focus on sterilizing and non-sterilizing immunity. After some reading some things clicked into place. I am vaccinated with a non-sterilizing vaccine (moderna). Odds are I will be infected with the virus or a variant like delta. I am not really immune, and will likely have a mild infection until a mutated variant shows up that is effectively like a new virus again or the vaccine effects have worn off.

Those who had the virus and recovered naturally without long term problems are likely immune in the traditional sense and if healthy are better protected than me. They also might be able to get a mutated variant some day after the virus has changed. We all are in that boat. They will not have any possible side effects from the vaccine, so that may be a bonus. (Yes, I know the vaccines are supposed to be without risk, but I am not ready to make that call.) ( Yes, I know it is not my call to make outside of my own thinking.) So, I still do not see why the push to have the naturally immune vaccinated. I get they may not all have equal levels of immunity, but they did survive and get well.


So, if I read the links correctly the vaccinated like me are very likely to run into the virus and have a mild case. That I also will shed virus just like a non-vaccinated person who gets ill. So the vaccines are sorta like a mask. Can be somewhat helpful, but not a cure and will not prevent an infection.

I see why the push to get all vaccinated better. The vaccines have big flaws. They work in a way but not in the traditional sense of the older style vaccines. I wonder why I have only been hearing this from so very few such as shogun32. Why have the experts not just said the vaccines have holes in the way they work?

Whatever the reasons the experts in charge had for handling the talk the way they did, the result is they have lost the trust of too many. I can see they have been talking around these things lately. I guess they just do not want to directly say the vaccines are flawed now. However just like the masks, the story is getting out and if they tell it straight even more credibility will be lost. How many months have we been told the vaccines are work real well.

I went round and round on a different site about how can a vaccinated person can have a viral load similar to a sick unvaccinated person. He claimed to have great understanding but was not getting the message thru. He kept telling me the vaccines are working great, or maybe what he was saying they are working the way they are meant to work. That I am not protected from the virus with the vaccine, just that I likely will not get very sick. But I might get sick and may even die with the vaccine. When I get sick I likely will not know it and will be shedding virus to others.

I have not completely digested the notion of how the non-sterilizing vaccines can actually cause a more dangerous virus mutation yet. I do follow the basic concept. If this turns out to be the case the implication seems to be the vaccines could possibly have us wind up with a much worse viral disease than we would have had without the vaccines. I know this does not sound like it ought to be right, but so far such is my take. Again I think shogun32 has been saying this or something like this for a while. It just had not clicked for me.

It would be nice if someone who has understanding and command of the subject could polish the concept in language better than mine.
 
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celebrist said:
That's why you shouldn't make the bed ;)

Glad you two aren't getting worse and seem to be on the slow mend and also that your daughter is doing well
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Thanks.
Boredom is becoming an issue, never thought I'd say this but I want to get back to work. Not ready for it yet though. I'm a carpenter so if making the bed does me in I'm definitely not ready to carry heavy tools and timber about just yet.
 
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pacu mom said:
news.yahoo.com

Delta infections among vaccinated likely contagious; Lambda variant shows vaccine resistance in lab

The following is a roundup of some of the latest scientific studies on the novel coronavirus and efforts to find treatments and vaccines for COVID-19. Among people infected by the Delta variant of the coronavirus, fully vaccinated people with "breakthrough" infections may be just as likely as...
news.yahoo.com news.yahoo.com
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Quote from link:
"getting a third dose of an mRNA vaccine from Pfizer/BioNTech or Moderna would likely increase levels of antibodies, but not antibodies that are better able to neutralize new virus variants, "
 
Hello; I think it will of value to repost some information about the "vaccines" being given for the covid virus. It took me a long time to follow another's lead and read up on what he has been saying for a while. He had some good information with his reference to a non-sterilizing vaccine.

The first of what seems deceptive was using the term vaccine and not making some clear distinctions about the differences which makes the injections we have been given not the same as traditional vaccines. Not sure what the injections could have been called, but vaccine does not seem to fit now.

For a time, I was not looking close enough at the language used. I mistakenly was focused on how the mRNA injections were made and not on how the injections worked. An additional mistake was letting the word vaccine get in the way of my thinking. These injections appear to be working the way they are meant to work. It is we, well me anyway, who have been expecting them to be like the traditional vaccines. It seems they are not meant to work in the traditional way. Let me say I will not be posting here about the safety of the injections. That is a topic for another day.

A traditional vaccine would start a reaction in our immune system and in a couple of weeks we would be "immune" in the same sort of way of surviving an infection of a virus naturally.
(Here is where a note will be needed to stave off a type of rebuttal -not everyone who got a traditional vaccine got a good immune reaction to be sure. However, there is a distinction with a difference with these new mRNA injections. With the traditional vaccines in those who did not have a good immune reaction the vaccine could be said to not be working as intended. With the mRNA injections for those of us who do not get a good immune system reaction it is being stated the injections are working as they are meant to.)

With the mRNA injections it is become clear that many of us who had them will become infected with the virus to the point of shedding virus at levels similar to or greater than an infected person who did not get the injections. That those of us who had the injections are "good" in the sense we will most likely have a mild or even an asymptomatic case of the infection. However, we will be infected none the less. Some number of us who had the injections and get what is called a "pass thru" infection will get very ill and a few of us will die. This is the way I work it out so far. I figure anything I get incorrect will be pointed out.

Just as very early on in the virus outbreak when we were told masks do not work so they could be saved for medical workers, I would have wanted to be told how the injections were meant to work from the start. I knew better about the masks from the start. I was not aware about the differences of new injections and had in mind because they were called vaccines that they worked like traditional vaccines.

I get that I am likely statistically better off after having the injections than if I had not had the injections when I run into the virus. Not sure what the actual odds are, so will use a general scale. When I run into the virus there apparently is a good chance I will have a mild infection. There is some less of a chance I will have a more severe case and maybe even less of a chance of death.

The story so far is the injected are by the numbers better off that those who get the virus without the injections. How the numbers will work out is not known by me so far. It will be of interest to judge the value of the injections compared to those who did not get them.

In a previous post I wrote along similar lines. I used terms such as the new vaccines have holes in the way they work and that the vaccines have flaws. That my comments were not addressed back then tells something. If I have made mistakes here is a place to point them out so I will not include mistakes in future posts.

On a personal level I have an in-law who decided to skip the injections. I have been around that person a few times. Her husband got the injections and goes to work. We were thinking for some months now that we held no risk to her. Turns out either one of us can be infected and not be aware. This is what I meant when I mentioned the mask lie a few sentences ago. I happened to have known better about the masks, but did not know and understand about the holes in the way the new injections work.

It, in my opinion, would have been better to tell us up front the new injections do not work the way older vaccines did. To let us know in clear terms getting an injection will not keep us from getting the virus and passing it on. I get that we were in a roundabout way given the information. That it is likely if a person wanted to go back and dig into the fine print the information was available. Maybe the point of view was we could have looked past the headlines on taking the new injections and find the information so the cover you behind angle was covered.

For a long time, I was hearing vaccine and thinking of the traditional sort. I was slow on the uptake that these new mRNA injections do not work in the traditional ways. So in the end I did not do my due diligence is one way to look at it.
 
None of this should be a surprise to anyone that has kept up on the subject. Quite frankly I can't believe this is even being discussed at this point.

Influenza vaccines work in the same way, as in they are not 100% foolproof. -One can still get the FLU, but if/when that happens, they do not typically get seriously ill, or die. Same as covid vaccines, flu virus germs would also be shed by those that are sick. BTW - there is no exact % given currently, by any peer reviewed paper that I have seen, regarding how much virus is being shed, by vaccinated people. Lots of smack talk on the internet, but nothing backed by any science based peer reviewed journals.

Call it whatever you choose, not all vaccines are foolproof. In fact when it comes to individual immune responses, amongst the millions being given a vaccine - there are no guarantees. There never has been.

But now we should expect more, from a set of vaccines created under extreme conditions, during a world-wide pandemic?

Yeah, ok, sure.
 
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Prior to June, the Delta variant wasn't the dominant strain. It worked differently, even with the lower vaccination rate, there weren't as people in hospitals. The Delta variant is different.

I was never under the impression that vaccinations/injections for viruses were 100% fool proof. (Heck, the way mRNA worked, I found quite interesting last year) The many variations of the flu virus has proved this to me for years. I already knew the percentages that the manufacturer's gave for effectiveness had a possibility of going down once millions of people took the vaccine. This always happens with any vaccine. The bright side is that you now within months versus years or decades.

I know that masks work against viruses. I haven't gotten a cold/flu since February 2020. I've been working onsite since Oct 2020. We've had an 2 outbreaks at work since late June 2021 once unvaccinated folks lied about their vaccine status and didn't mask up. Their careers have changed whether by the company or their work peers.

I also personally know of a breakthrough case that just got infected in the last week. The Moderna shots had no effect on her (really wasn't tailored for Delta variant). Right now, she feels like she has a really really bad flu and is bed ridden. There's no doubt in my friend's mind that his wife would be hospitalized or worse if it wasn't for the vaccine.
 
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She was infected after the vaccination?
. . . or perhaps she was infected before the shot and didn’t show symptoms until after the vaccination? How do you tell?

Moderna is what they are giving here, and it seems I have put it off another week and not gotten the injection. If it’s not found effective for the Delta (or future) types maybe they will offer something else here. Anyhow, my wife who has had moderns twice, is out running around right now spreading my Delta variant germs. Or bringing them home to me.

I have to mention that while I was totally uncomfortable taking traditional flu vaccines, I am no more comfortable taking messenger RNA,that essentially turns me into a genetically modified organism.

This is a freakish idea, and has been explored in the past in science-fiction literature to some degree. There are classic examples where the planet changes man’s biology, to conform with it, to save him.

(No, I do not believe any planet is sentient.)

But to a lot of people the idea of having their body altered genetically is frightening. It’s a good thing that they didn’t tell my wife how this works or they never would’ve got her to take it. She is too afraid of GMO‘s.

Personally, I feel that I, like most people, can deal with GMO’s, and the ones who cannot (or their future kids) may be screwed by now.
 
Delta variant is doing its thing in my community of less than 28,000 people. 189 new infections in the last 14 days. 134 active cases with 11 people in our very small hospital. 2 deaths this week.

This is how quickly things could possibly change for any one. Immediate family member not in our household, had take out lunch twice with my husband last week (riding and eating in the car together). Yesterday he had a "head cold". He has not been tested. If it turns out he has COVID-19, my husband and I are also infected. Who gets colds at this time of year? The only place I don't wear a mask is in my house and car, and yet, even though I haven't been around him, I have been exposed to whatever my son has :( Scheduled for COVID-19 tests tomorrow at 8 am.
 
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