Help - something wrong with Texas lips/mouth

[SaltyPlum]

At this point, the bacteria is in the tank, and whether the immunity of the other fish is strong enough to ward it off is anybody's guess.
If the water temp is above 82'F, I'd slowly reduce it by a couple degrees.
I don't know what the other fish are, but these northern Mexican Herichthys do not need higher temps.
I've kept them as low as high 60s. (a list of other species would help determine how far you can go).
I must admit after I experienced Columnaris, I sanitized the entire tank, all gear water touched, and expected any other cichlids in the tank were going to be goners. (it seems to sometimes be species specific)
But treating with antibiotic effective against Gram Neg bacteria could ward off the worst case scenario.
This is the one disease that prompted me to give all new fish be given a 2 month quarantine before putting in the main tank with others.

Question to your quarantine methods to avoid the spread of Columnaris. Thanks to your info and some past posts that I've read, and also doing a bit of research regarding Columnaris. My understanding of this dreadful disease is that it is highly contagious and can survive in a single drop of water and even some cases mud. So even though you are quaranting fish for 2 months, if the new fish just so happened to be already carrying this disease, wouldn't your quarantine system also be affected, and when the time came to transfer the fish into gen pop it would still be carrying this disease?

To me it sounds like corona virus to fish and the only way for fish to survive and live with this disease is to create a vaccine and have them all vacinated.

If you have any advice/suggestions on how to bomb my tanks to wipe this disease for good that would be much appreciated.

I'm just thinking ahead in case all my stock is affected and died, what do I need to do to my tanks and equipment to restock and start over, but I also don't want to accidentally contaminate any other systems I currently have running. Than I get thinking, well what if my new fish are carrying this disease and all my time and effort spent sterilising and cleaning my system and equipment was a waste of time because the new fish have now infected my system.

This disease has me stressing and confused.

 

[kno4te]

I don't think it'll treat columnaris . Metro treats internal parasites better .
kno4te duanes RD. Rocksor could suggest better meds.

I’d dose furan2 and kanamycin together.

 

[duanes]

, wouldn't your quarantine system also be affected, and when the time came to transfer the fish into gen pop it would still be carrying this disease?

To me it sounds like corona virus to fish and the only way for fish to survive and live with this disease is to create a vaccine and have them all vacinated.

Yes if a QT tank ends up with Columnaris, I bleach that entire system.
If one fish in the QT is infected with Columnaris, I now, euthanize all fish from that tank.

And yes because a tank is basically a microcosm of the world

As a retired microbiologist I see this as very much like Covid,.
Until every human is the world vaccinated, Covid will be a problem. Ail unvacinated are diseasel reservoirs and are potential spreaders.

If any fish in the tank has Columnaris, it will loom over the aquarists head, and effect any fish that has anything compromising its immunity.
Could be stress, wrong temp, aggressive tank mates, anything stressful, and Columnaris finds a way to return, unless it totally totally annihilated from the system.

When Columnaris arrived with the one Mayaheros beanii, all 3 were in quarantine, the first one died within about a week, it took the other 2 another month to show symptoms, but eventually they died in QT .
After this, I tore down the entire system, bleached it, any siphons, air tubes, filters substrate even the light bars that took splash were bleached, before putting it back into service at least a month after the disease was eliminated.

 

[SaltyPlum]

Yes if a QT tank ends up with Columnaris, I bleach that entire system.
If one fish in the QT is infected with Columnaris, I now, euthanize all fish from that tank.

And yes because a tank is basically a microcosm of the world

As a retired microbiologist I see this as very much like Covid,.
Until every human is the world vaccinated, Covid will be a problem. Ail unvacinated are diseasel reservoirs and are potential spreaders.

If any fish in the tank has Columnaris, it will loom over the aquarists head, and effect any fish that has anything compromising its immunity.
Could be stress, wrong temp, aggressive tank mates, anything stressful, and Columnaris finds a way to return, unless it totally totally annihilated from the system.

When Columnaris arrived with the one Mayaheros beanii, all 3 were in quarantine, the first one died within about a week, it took the other 2 another month to show symptoms, but eventually they died in QT .
After this, I tore down the entire system, bleached it, any siphons, air tubes, filters substrate even the light bars that took splash were bleached, before putting it back into service at least a month after the disease was eliminated.

.
Oh man that's a massive effort and a hassle to do and deal with. The most stressful thing about this columnaris is not knowing. Like I don't know if I have this bacterial disease or not. All my fish seem fine, but I have multiple tanks and systems and I don't want to risk cross contaminating this virus to other tanks and systems, so what do I do? Is there something that I can put in my system that will kill this virus and treat my fish at the same time?

Leading up to your post I was actually thinking if all my fish started to show signs of sickness from that particular system, I will most likely have to euthanize them all, bomb my tank with either bleach or vinegar and let in run for a week or two, add new media and cycle the system again before adding fish.

 

[duanes]

It's obvious to me from the 1st pic, and later how quickly it died once those symptoms presented, it is/was Columnaris.

Its not viral, but bacterial.
So at least you know its possible to treat with antibiotics, with a virus, antibiotics don't work.

At the time it showed up, I had 20 tanks going (most over 100 gal each), and cross contamination was my fear, which is why, I took drastic action.

The 2 photos above are advanced stages, below when I first noticed it.

 

[SaltyPlum]

It's obvious to me from the 1st pic, and later how quickly it died once those symptoms presented, it is/was Columnaris.
View attachment 1473553
Its not viral, but bacterial.
So at least you know its possible to treat with antibiotics, with a virus, antibiotics don't work.

At the time it showed up, I had 20 tanks going (most over 100 gal each), and cross contamination was my fear, which is why, I took drastic action.
View attachment 1473554
The 2 photos above are advanced stages, below when I first noticed it.
View attachment 1473555

My question now is, is it even worth treating your fish at all if they have this virus, or are you better of euthanizing all stock and bombing your system and equipment to avoid the risk of cross contamination? Going of your previous post regarding the quarantine issue, sounds like you don't roll the dice when you feel you have an outbreak!

I now know fish can be treated with antibiotics, but the water will always be infected right? and you will never know when it will strike again. For me, not knowing whether I have this is really stressful because I don't want to risk contaminating other tanks. I just got another rack up and running close to this system in my fish room with expensive fish expected to arrive in the coming weeks and I don't like this feeling on whether I have a bacterial infection looming around.

 

[duanes]

This is why I euthanize, and sterilize the tank if it shows up again.
I was lucky, I only had the 3 fish in the tank, but didn't want to take a chance with the other 19 tanks.

 

[Rocksor]

Yup sterilizing the tank is the only way to go. I had a fast acting columnaris infection on a quarantined wild fish too. The fish died within 3 days, and I had chosen the wrong antibiotic at the time (Erythromycin). I didn't sterilize the QT , and the next fish that was quarantined (even after draining the tank) died within 5 days. Only after bleaching everything that touched that QT, hoses, filter media, and tank was I able to use it again.

 

[SaltyPlum]

Yup sterilizing the tank is the only way to go. I had a fast acting columnaris infection on a quarantined wild fish too. The fish died within 3 days, and I had chosen the wrong antibiotic at the time (Erythromycin). I didn't sterilize the QT , and the next fish that was quarantined (even after draining the tank) died within 5 days. Only after bleaching everything that touched that QT, hoses, filter media, and tank was I able to use it again.

Yeah I think that's what I will end up doing, but none of my other fish are showing signs of sickness or acting differently. My male Texas died fairly quickly, but my female Texas is fine, and I have a bunch of other fish on the same system and which are all doing fine. If columnaris is highly contagious and fatal, shouldn't they be showing signs by now?

 

[Rocksor]

Yeah I think that's what I will end up doing, but none of my other fish are showing signs of sickness or acting differently. My male Texas died fairly quickly, but my female Texas is fine, and I have a bunch of other fish on the same system and which are all doing fine. If columnaris is highly contagious and fatal, shouldn't they be showing signs by now?

It's opportunistic. When the stress levels are high enough or an injury is sustained, the other fish will eventually succumb. Right now all of their immune systems are able to keep it in check. If you plan to keep the fish in that tank, just don't service it the same days as your other tanks, and use different equipment that doesn't cross over. Maybe put masking/ colored electric tape on any equipment that is used on that tank.