Pufferpunk;1814369; said:
There is a distinct difference between constant water changes and 100% water changes.
100% water changes
- Thread starter xander
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There is a distinct difference between constant water changes and 100% water changes.
jcardona1;1814456; said:
Easy killer! There's nothing wrong with some good discussion. If you don't like the thread, don't read it. It's pretty simple. No need to get all hostile!
haha not getting hostile, i like this thread and it has good discussions. but when the OP gets to being downright rude to people for no reason, thats just not cool!
jcardona1;1814486; said:
I guess I must have missed where he was being rude. Yeah, that's not cool. It's good to have a discussion where everybody is respectful of all opinions and views expressed.
Hawkfish3.0;1814363;1814363 said:
I agree with this and what Oddball said. Yes, youre beneficial bacteria will still be alive, but there will be a time lag in re-establishing the bio-load and food source for your bacteria (the ammonia). Now i'm not sure how long it may take to re-establish the bio-load, but I'm pretty sure some bacteria may die off as they dont have the food source to keep them alive.
And if some your bacteria die off, you may not have enough BB in your filters to cope with the bio-load once it reaches its normal levels, which in turn could be harmful to your fish as ammonia may do a mini-spike
and i found this regarding the affect of ph on fish. this is relevant to the ph fluctuations:
http://www.freshwater-aquarium-fish.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=26&Itemid=1
pH defines how acidic or basic the water is. The term "pH" describes the amount of hydrogen (H+) and hydroxide (OH-) ions dissolved in a solution. (For those who are interested, in mathematical terms pH is defined at the negative log of the hydrogen ion concentration.) The more hydrogen ions there are, the more acidic the water is and the lower the pH is. A solution that has equal concentrations of hydroxide and hydrogen is termed neutral with a pH value of 7. A higher concentration of hydroxide ions would return a value above 7 or alkaline. A higher concentration of hydrogen ions would return a value below 7 or acidic. The pH scale is logarithmic, in other words, each step up or down is 10 times that of the previous one. A pH of 6 is ten times more acidic than a pH of 7. A pH of 5 is a 100 times more acidic than 7 and so on.
Most freshwater fish live within a pH range of 5.5 to 7.5 (African chiclids can go up to 8.4). Since the scale is logarithmic, this range represents a variation of over a 1000 times. Even an apparently small change in pH can affect fish, causing stress or death.
The consequences for fish are many and varied. It affects their breathing ability. High acidity or alkalinity can cause direct physical damage to skin, gills and eyes. Prolonged exposure to sub-lethal pH levels can cause stress, increase mucus production and encourage epithelial hyperplasia (thickening of the skin or gill epithelia) with sometimes-fatal consequences.
There are indirect consequences that can also affect fish. Changes in pH will affect the toxicity of many dissolved compounds. For example, ammonia becomes more toxic as pH increases. Fluctuations in pH, even though they may still be within the preferred range, can be stressful and damaging to fish health. Nitrifying bacteria, essential in the conversion of ammonia to nitrate also have a pH range preference, which is between 7.5 and 8.6. Variations in pH will also have an effect on some disease treatments. Chloramine-T is more toxic at low pH, while potassium permanganate is more dangerous at high pH.
Monitoring the pH in an established aquarium can often indicate water change and substrate vacuuming needs, or a clogged under-gravel filter. Excess waste product produces carbonic acid, which acidifies the water and lowers the pH.
While selecting fish that are compatible to the pH of the water used to fill the aquarium is the best method and avoids the need to change the pH, many aquarists want keep a species of fish that may require pH alteration. Many fish can accept a limited pH range, however breeding may be more difficult if not impossible. There are methods of altering the pH in your aquarium.
http://www.freshwater-aquarium-fish.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=26&Itemid=1
pH defines how acidic or basic the water is. The term "pH" describes the amount of hydrogen (H+) and hydroxide (OH-) ions dissolved in a solution. (For those who are interested, in mathematical terms pH is defined at the negative log of the hydrogen ion concentration.) The more hydrogen ions there are, the more acidic the water is and the lower the pH is. A solution that has equal concentrations of hydroxide and hydrogen is termed neutral with a pH value of 7. A higher concentration of hydroxide ions would return a value above 7 or alkaline. A higher concentration of hydrogen ions would return a value below 7 or acidic. The pH scale is logarithmic, in other words, each step up or down is 10 times that of the previous one. A pH of 6 is ten times more acidic than a pH of 7. A pH of 5 is a 100 times more acidic than 7 and so on.
Most freshwater fish live within a pH range of 5.5 to 7.5 (African chiclids can go up to 8.4). Since the scale is logarithmic, this range represents a variation of over a 1000 times. Even an apparently small change in pH can affect fish, causing stress or death.
The consequences for fish are many and varied. It affects their breathing ability. High acidity or alkalinity can cause direct physical damage to skin, gills and eyes. Prolonged exposure to sub-lethal pH levels can cause stress, increase mucus production and encourage epithelial hyperplasia (thickening of the skin or gill epithelia) with sometimes-fatal consequences.
There are indirect consequences that can also affect fish. Changes in pH will affect the toxicity of many dissolved compounds. For example, ammonia becomes more toxic as pH increases. Fluctuations in pH, even though they may still be within the preferred range, can be stressful and damaging to fish health. Nitrifying bacteria, essential in the conversion of ammonia to nitrate also have a pH range preference, which is between 7.5 and 8.6. Variations in pH will also have an effect on some disease treatments. Chloramine-T is more toxic at low pH, while potassium permanganate is more dangerous at high pH.
Monitoring the pH in an established aquarium can often indicate water change and substrate vacuuming needs, or a clogged under-gravel filter. Excess waste product produces carbonic acid, which acidifies the water and lowers the pH.
While selecting fish that are compatible to the pH of the water used to fill the aquarium is the best method and avoids the need to change the pH, many aquarists want keep a species of fish that may require pH alteration. Many fish can accept a limited pH range, however breeding may be more difficult if not impossible. There are methods of altering the pH in your aquarium.
jcardona1;1814514; said:
Agreed, however, I would be more worried about a nitrite spike as it's the second step in the nitrogen cycle. Your bacteria that feeds on NH3 would be the first to have it's food source replenished. The bacteria that feeds on nitrites would have to wait for the other bacteria to process the NH3 first, causing a temporary shortage in nitrites. Thus the second stage bacteria would starve and die off. Once they die off you leave your tank open to a nitrite spike.
I would say that the only way to avoid these situations with a 100% water change, is once you perform a 100% change, you must continue to do so on a frequent basis in order to avoid these harmful situations. It would be a lot of work and not feasible for the average hobbyist. Now if you are a breeder and this is your livelihood, I would say that it comes with the territory.
yeah that makes sense. another question, do you think these mini-spikes would be significant enough to have a negative affect on the fish? i guess this would really depend on how sensitive the fish are...
Hawkfish3.0;1814363; said:
If you had monster poop makers like I do, bioload is not an issue. My big fellows usually poop before the tank is filled up again. If you have fish in your tank, and you feed them at all, they are always urinating and defecating, and the uneaten food particles are breaking down. If there are fish, there is no reason to worry about an ammonia source. The fish are your ammonia source, NOT the dirty tank water with high nitrates. In a cycled tank, there will be no ammonia to remove since the BB are consuming the ammonia and ultimately converting it into nitrates via nitrites. The fish themselves are the ammonia source. Just do water changes to get your nitrates low. If you keep the nitrates fairly low, there is no reason to worry about old tank syndrome, and you can change out as much water as you want.
If you have a few small fish that don't produce much waste, you're not going to have high nitrates, so you wouldn't be changing out that much water. Also, you are only going to have enough BB to accommodate the bioload of the tank. (This is why when you fishless cycle a tank, you add enough ammonia to the tank to get an ammonia reading of at least 4 ppm. That is more ammonia than most fish are going to produce in one day--and you build up massive quantities of BB that will more than accommodate the bioload of your tank. After fishless cycling this way, you can safely move your fish to the new tank knowing that you have enough BB to handle the bioload) Oh to have a tank with a bioload so small that I had to worry about my BB
