Haven't we been down this road before with no results? I'd say call Don if you really want to know. No one is going to just post the info unfortunately. They are probably VERY expensive so I'll just wait it out for fry.
Cichlasoma ornatum???
- Thread starter dogofwar
- Start date
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
body structure is very similar between Mels pair and the pic from Ira if you pause Mel's video towards the very end.... I guess only time will tell
Unfortunately we have. Seems like a pattern of bold claims of exclusive access to holy grail fish and collecting locales followed by no information to verify or corroborate anything.... or worse.
I am far from convinced that the fish in the picture is C. ornatum. As is, it seems, the guy who's actually keeping these fish (Mel).
Seems like the burden of proof is on the seller. Especially in the case of really rare fish like C. ornatum.
But accurately identifying fish and being able to provide information is about more than preventing fraudulent sales transactions. It's about learning and sharing information about the fish and their habitats. An attitude that shuts out questions and interest not coming from a prospective purchaser seems contrary to the spirit of this forum.
Probably the only thing worse than these not being in the hobby is for them to be in the hobby...unintentionally hybridized with verifiable ornatum from other sources...and then sold as pure (or "wild"...not that that would happen)...
Matt
I am far from convinced that the fish in the picture is C. ornatum. As is, it seems, the guy who's actually keeping these fish (Mel).
Seems like the burden of proof is on the seller. Especially in the case of really rare fish like C. ornatum.
But accurately identifying fish and being able to provide information is about more than preventing fraudulent sales transactions. It's about learning and sharing information about the fish and their habitats. An attitude that shuts out questions and interest not coming from a prospective purchaser seems contrary to the spirit of this forum.
Probably the only thing worse than these not being in the hobby is for them to be in the hobby...unintentionally hybridized with verifiable ornatum from other sources...and then sold as pure (or "wild"...not that that would happen)...
Matt
NorCaliCichlids;4093599; said:Haven't we been down this road before with no results? I'd say call Don if you really want to know. No one is going to just post the info unfortunately. They are probably VERY expensive so I'll just wait it out for fry.
Seriously, Don will tell you everything you want to know. I dont think these are any kind of hybrid. Don was having a hard time getting a hold on ANY of these or the Atromaculatum as of 2 months ago due to FARC rebels. It would be nice for educational purposes to know all there is to know but that won't happen. Don did tell me he was going after the 'red' form of Ornatum.
...wouldn't it be easier / better for the vendor to get the information from Don to post here...or (better yet) have the information available prior to posting? Imagine going to your local Chevy dealership after seeing an ad and the dealer not knowing anything about what they're selling...other than that they're the exclusive dealer for the one of a kind car...
I'm not claiming that the fish in the picture is a hybrid. No one has been able to positively ID it... But crossing the fish in the picture and one of Mel's fish seems like it would be a hybrid!
If there are different forms / populations of ornatum (are there?), wouldn't it be even MORE critical to ensure that people know what kind that they have, the collection locations, etc. so they don't unintentionally create / pass on hybrids...or cross collection locations?
Matt
I'm not claiming that the fish in the picture is a hybrid. No one has been able to positively ID it... But crossing the fish in the picture and one of Mel's fish seems like it would be a hybrid!
If there are different forms / populations of ornatum (are there?), wouldn't it be even MORE critical to ensure that people know what kind that they have, the collection locations, etc. so they don't unintentionally create / pass on hybrids...or cross collection locations?
Matt
NorCaliCichlids;4094023; said:Seriously, Don will tell you everything you want to know. I dont think these are any kind of hybrid. Don was having a hard time getting a hold on ANY of these or the Atromaculatum as of 2 months ago due to FARC rebels. It would be nice for educational purposes to know all there is to know but that won't happen. Don did tell me he was going after the 'red' form of Ornatum.
You'll get no argument from me at all buddy. It's just not likely to happen. Only certain people seem to know the info and they seem sworn to secrecy. I'd like to see some more pics too.
NorCaliCichlids;4094023; said:Seriously, Don will tell you everything you want to know. I dont think these are any kind of hybrid. Don was having a hard time getting a hold on ANY of these or the Atromaculatum as of 2 months ago due to FARC rebels. It would be nice for educational purposes to know all there is to know but that won't happen. Don did tell me he was going after the 'red' form of Ornatum.
Something tells me he isn't too keen on talking to me at the moment! Haha!
Did he say HE was collecting these? Or is he having one of his Columbian suppliers collect them. Some silly Gringo out in the jungles of Columbia could very easily be turned into ransom money the way things go down there!
'Red' form? How many forms of ornatum are there?
I believe there is the 'green' we see and a 'red' riverine form he is trying to get (or apparently already has?). Yeah, being an american these days in a foreign country is a target on your back for hostage takers.
Interesting about the different varieties. Who knew?
I travel pretty frequently on business and for pleasure, including to Colombia (about 2 years ago)... and - believe it or not - I found it to be a pretty safe and fun place. I wasn't collecting fish in the Rio San Juan basin (which seems pretty poor and rural) but spent time in Bogota, Medellin and a couple of other places...
Like anywhere, it makes sense to keep your wits about you...but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Colombia for a vacation destination.
Matt
I travel pretty frequently on business and for pleasure, including to Colombia (about 2 years ago)... and - believe it or not - I found it to be a pretty safe and fun place. I wasn't collecting fish in the Rio San Juan basin (which seems pretty poor and rural) but spent time in Bogota, Medellin and a couple of other places...
Like anywhere, it makes sense to keep your wits about you...but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Colombia for a vacation destination.
Matt
NorCaliCichlids;4095241; said:I believe there is the 'green' we see and a 'red' riverine form he is trying to get (or apparently already has?). Yeah, being an american these days in a foreign country is a target on your back for hostage takers.
