Congos VS Exodons. + other news today.

[Umbra]

I've had luck long term with Microglanis iheringi, Crenicichla compressiceps, smaller Tatia sp., Platydoras costatus, banjo cats, amazon soles, etc. As you can see, mostly fish that dwell in the lower 1/4 of the tank, haven't had too much luck with midwater fish, just endless fighting.

Interestingly, I had a group of 10 juvenile (2") Cetopsis coecutiens with a larger group of same sized exos and it worked out for a while. The exos almost appeared to avoid the Cetopsis catfish and vice versa. It worked well until the Cetopsis outgrew the exodons (about 4.5" vs 3") and their hyperactivity/aggression during feedings started to really stress the exos out. I separated them after I fed them a large chunk of shrimp - one of the Cetopsis ended up biting an exodon instead of the shrimp in the frenzy, took a good sized chunk out of the exo's caudal peduncle along with most of the fin.
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[bitteraspects]

I think you're confused about what "long term" means. If you had to remove the other fish because they outgrew the exos, then it did not work long term.
Have you had any for an 8year period with these tankmates?
5years?
3?

Its a hypothetical question. I already know the answer.

 

[Umbra]

I think you're confused about what "long term" means. If you had to remove the other fish because they outgrew the exos, then it did not work long term.
Have you had any for an 8year period with these tankmates?
5years?
3?

Its a hypothetical question. I already know the answer.

I had the Cetopsis with them on a separate occasion and was not long term, hence I included it separate with the rest of the fish that I did mention I kept long term with the exos. The rest of the fish mentioned were in a planted 75 breeder for a good 2.5 years and were close to if not fully grown before I lost my favourite fish in a power outage and decided to tear all my tanks down and leave the hobby.

Let me ask you some questions, have you ever kept any of the aforementioned fish with them? For how long a period of time? Are you aware that C. compressiceps, M. iheringi, P. costatus and banjo cats do not grow large enough to actively prey upon E. paradoxus? Are you aware that fish in captivity don't behave the same way they do in their natural habitat and that combinations between different species of fish that might not occur together naturally are possible?

BTW those are all hypothetical questions, I already know the answers

EDIT:

All the "research" on fish biology/morphology in the world can't be correlated directly to keeping fish in aquarium conditions. The conditions vary too much from the wild to an aquarium, and from tank to tank as well. Combinations of fish you'd never believe to work without seeing it may very well be possible in aquaria under the correct conditions.

 

[Umbra]

I had the Cetopsis with them on a separate occasion and was not long term, hence I included it separate with the rest of the fish that I did mention I kept long term with the exos. The rest of the fish mentioned were in a planted 75 breeder for a good 2.5 years and were close to if not fully grown before I lost my favourite fish in a power outage and decided to tear all my tanks down and leave the hobby.

Let me ask you some questions, have you ever kept any of the aforementioned fish with them? For how long a period of time? Are you aware that C. compressiceps, M. iheringi, P. costatus and banjo cats do not grow large enough to actively prey upon E. paradoxus? Are you aware that fish in captivity don't behave the same way they do in their natural habitat and that combinations between different species of fish that might not occur together naturally are possible?

BTW those are all hypothetical questions, I already know the answers

EDIT:

All the "research" on fish biology/morphology in the world can't be correlated directly to keeping fish in aquarium conditions. The conditions vary too much from the wild to an aquarium, and from tank to tank as well. Combinations of fish you'd never believe to work without seeing it may very well be possible in aquaria under the correct conditions.

Disregard this, we should probably start a new thread instead of derailing this one.

 

[bitteraspects]

no need for a new thread. after this:

All the "research" on fish biology/morphology in the world can't be correlated directly to keeping fish in aquarium conditions. The conditions vary too much from the wild to an aquarium, and from tank to tank as well. Combinations of fish you'd never believe to work without seeing it may very well be possible in aquaria under the correct conditions.

you pretty much trashed your credibility. im not sure what you imagine research means, but apparently you think its just guessing. how exactly is it you think they do the "research"

but again. no need to answer that. this thread is done.

 

[Umbra]

no need for a new thread. after this:



you pretty much trashed your credibility. im not sure what you imagine research means, but apparently you think its just guessing. how exactly is it you think they do the "research"

but again. no need to answer that. this thread is done.

LOL. Explain how you arrived at the conclusion that I believe research is just guessing? Assumption ? Unless you can provide factual data that can disprove my successful keeping of the fish with said tankmates (which you can't) then you're sitting no higher than me in this debate. If experimenting with tankmates is how the research you speak of is conducted, then I have my own research that speaks otherwise. Last I checked, M. iheringi is not a cory cat, and Crenicichla compressiceps certainly isn't a flame tetra.

You failed to answer my previous questions, so I could assume you haven't, meaning you can't give me an answer concerning those species on the same grounds as I can, as I am the one with the experience - but I'd be making assumptions just like yourself, right? Unless you've kept the same fish in the same sized tank under the same conditions that I did, you can't say anything to me about those species living with Exodon paradoxus. Haven't kept em? Don't speak.

However, I digress, you're right, this thread is done. I won't bother replying anymore, I'm bored of you. Next.

 

[bitteraspects]

LOL. Explain how you arrived at the conclusion that I believe research is just guessing? Assumption ?

you said yourself "All the "research" on fish biology/morphology in the world can't be correlated directly to keeping fish in aquarium ", which is absolutely false. and as you dont seem to be capable of understanding all that goes into researching this species (or any for that matter). research is exactly that. RESEARCH. i know this is a difficult concept for you.

Unless you can provide factual data that can disprove my successful keeping of the fish with said tankmates (which you can't) then you're sitting no higher than me in this debate. If experimenting with tankmates is how the research you speak of is conducted, then I have my own research that speaks otherwise. Last I checked, M. iheringi is not a cory cat, and Crenicichla compressiceps certainly isn't a flame tetra.

again, your inability to retain information is making you look foolish. i clearly said there are always exceptions. also, i never said i was not possible, just highly unlikely. and as your so called "long term" comm, was a short period of time, you have NO "research" of your own.
maybe instead of responding, you should have read what you were responding to. i said 2 types of corys (cf. julii and cf. nanus), as well as Fire Tetras (Hyphessobrycon amandae) and Otocinclus cf. affinis, are gathered in the same waters as exodon paradoxus, and can be kept together in captive. this is also true for other species such as Red-eyed Moenkhausia (M. oligalepis). this is just a small piece of the info i gathered through correspondence with Heiko Bleher (just one of the people i consulted in my research) who has researched this species in the amazon.
never once did i say it is not possible to keep them together. in fact, i clearly said anything is possible. just not suggested, and not a good idea. as i have both successfully, and unsuccessfully housed other types of fish with exodons.

You failed to answer my previous questions, so I could assume you haven't, meaning you can't give me an answer concerning those species on the same grounds as I can, as I am the one with the experience - but I'd be making assumptions just like yourself, right? Unless you've kept the same fish in the same sized tank under the same conditions that I did, you can't say anything to me about those species living with Exodon paradoxus. Haven't kept em? Don't speak.

your so called "experience" is absolutely irrelevant. as you tried it once, and had this comm for a short period of time, and had no control test in what you are convinced is an educated study of some sort. it was nothing more than a poor stocking decision, that likely would have gone very wrong if you had done it over the life period of any one of the species involved.

though those two species in particular i have not kept (as pikes are illegal for import, and bumblebee cats are...well... lame.) but i have kept other types of cats/ loaches/ cichlids/ etc with exodons. while armored cats, and groups of CL, weather loach, and pakistani loach did well (with the loaches needing to be in a group of 5 or more), cichlids DID NOT. as i explained a few times at tis point, keeping cichlids with exodons will ilkely end one of two ways. the exodons will kill the cichlids (either by tearing them apart, or stressing them into a corner), or the cichlid will get large enough to eat the exodons. once again, as explained to you more than once now, this is not a law, but rather a responsible stocking suggestion (much like the 1"/ gal rule).
is it possible that they can be kept together for life? i wouldn't rule it out. im sure just about anything is "possible". but then again, you wouldn't be able to say, as you only did it for a mere 2.5 years (allegedly)
is it a good idea to try it? absolutely not. its actually pretty irresponsible.

However, I digress, you're right, this thread is done. I won't bother replying anymore, I'm bored of you. Next.

im glad you're finally bored of your inexperience and lack of knowledge on the subject. hopefully this will give you the drive to either continue research, or let it go, and leave it to others

best of luck

 

[Retuks]

Are you aware that fish in captivity don't behave the same way they do in their natural habitat and that combinations between different species of fish that might not occur together naturally are possible?

Red: uhhh generally predatory and aggressive fish are more aggressive in smaller quarters than the wild...

Orange: LOL NO CRAP! aahahahahaha. Aquarium??? you choose the species??

 

[Rambo85]

I guess this is a good time to chip in and say i have been keeping a breeding adult pair of Herotilapia multispinosa in a 35g breeder with 20 exodons for 2 and a half years. The tank is lightly planted with sand substrate, floating plants and plenty of driftwood and coconut shells scattered around.

The only issue I have encountered is the cichlid fry are eaten by the exodons each time they become free swimming. Spawning occurs like clockwork every 19 days at which time the parents defend the spawn site (defend is too stronger word - they occasionally chase an intruder out), highlighting the only time there is aggression between the two species.

I accept that this will stress the parents and possibly the exodons to some degree, but that aside I have seen nothing to suggest the fish are not healthy. As both species are fully grown I expect the only hunting would be done by the exodons, and i have seen no such behaviour. Of course 2 and a half years is certainly not a long term set up i thought it was worth sharing my experiences.

I believe that the potential for aggression may be diminished by the two species tending to congregate in different areas of the tank (exodons mid water and the cichlids the lower water column).

If you consider this irresponsible fish keeping I am surprised, if there was ever a serious issue between the two I would rehouse the cichlids to my community set up.

 

[Retuks]

I guess this is a good time to chip in and say i have been keeping a breeding adult pair of Herotilapia multispinosa in a 35g breeder with 20 exodons for 2 and a half years..

I read your whole reply but. ive had fish get killed by aggressive fish after living with eachother for over 10 years so all i have to say is... ok, 2 years down, 8 years more to find out... (give or take)