DIY over flow box.

[Mavrick813]

You're right, you don't understand. The Toms Aqua Lifter pump is not bullet proof, and is prone to failure. This causes the siphon to break. Then they stop sending water down to the sump, meanwhile the pump is still pumping to the tank. If you have enough water in the sump, then you get water on the floor. As for the pump making noise, that's great and all, if you're at home 24hrs a day. Some of us do have a life that involves leaving the house every now and then

I understand all this good and well. I understand that if the siphon breaks the return is going to pump everything it can back into your tank. But shouldn't part of the design for the sump be to not have more water on the return then the tank can allow for, Shouldn't the water line on the overflow be low enough so that if this failure were to happen the most that could happen is we lose a pump? Again I don't understand how even if the siphon breaks and the pump returns every drop of water it can how would that allow for water to go all over the floor?

EDIT: and nobody said anything about them 'emptying' your tank

As for this. I am pretty sure we were talking about 100s of gallons of water on the floor.

This sounds like a tank being emptied to me.

on a side note though...I am just terrified now of anything that could clog and while you are snoring away in the other room.....hundreds of gallon of tank water flowing away through your house.

And this.

Dude, it that thing clogs or a siphon is lost(like what happened to me) you will end up pumping out your entire tank onto your floor (like what happened to me lol)

And this.

Yeah, when mine over flowed I did not even hear it due to the TV.....My mother in law was at the computer in the OTHER room and started yelling about the carpet being soaked. Went through the wall and flooded two rooms.....only drilled for me too!

Please elaborate how if you have the water line set low enough, and a siphon break installed, and a sump return reservoir that will only allow for a certain amount of water return to your show tank. What kind of catastrophic failure could cause a tank to overflow on the floor?

 

[jcardona1]

Again I don't understand how even if the siphon breaks and the pump returns every drop of water it can how would that allow for water to go all over the floor?

The answer lies in your question..."siphon breaks". When the siphon breaks, water is NOT being sent down to the sump. So, the water level in the tank rises as the pump keeps pumping. Like I said, if there's enough water in your sump, it can spill over the lip of the tank. This can happen with the CPR overflows that use a Toms Aqua Lifter. It happened to a buddy of mine too. It has nothing to do with the design of the setup, nor how well you understand sumps. It's a potential problem when using this syle of overflow box.

And just so we're clear, I'm talking about this specific style of overflow box:

And the required Aqualifter pump:

 

[Mavrick813]

The answer lies in your question..."siphon breaks". When the siphon breaks, water is NOT being sent down to the sump. So, the water level in the tank rises as the pump keeps pumping. Like I said, if there's enough water in your sump, it can spill over the lip of the tank.

Crystal clear,

Would a good precautionary measure be to set your sump up in a way that it can't drain entirely into your tank should the siphon fail? IE: Maybe having your return draw it's water from near the top of your sump? That way if the siphon breaks, the return pump can only take so much water from the sump and put it back in your show tank?

I can see how having a pump on the outside of the sump drilled into the system through the side could cause problems. BUT even that could be worked around by drilling the side of the sump High and using PVC to route the water down to the pump.

Again, I agree that their is a potential concern with these HOB units. BUT the concerns all rely on the fact that their is a possibility of a siphon break. Which can be anticipated, and planned for.

Again, just my 2c.

Mike

 

[davdev]

I understand all this good and well. I understand that if the siphon breaks the return is going to pump everything it can back into your tank. But shouldn't part of the design for the sump be to not have more water on the return then the tank can allow for, Shouldn't the water line on the overflow be low enough so that if this failure were to happen the most that could happen is we lose a pump? Again I don't understand how even if the siphon breaks and the pump returns every drop of water it can how would that allow for water to go all over the floor?

That is how I set my tank up, there is no more water in the sump than can be handled by the tank. I understand one of the benefits of a sump is added water volume, but I don't trust it when dealing with a siphon style overflow. If it were drilled it would be a different story. So I have a 75 gallon tank with the DIY overflow leaving about 3 inches of room from the top of the tank. That gives me room for about 15 more gallons of water the tank could handle. This 15 gallons is sitting in the sump.
I have tested it by closing the valve on the overflow and letting the pump fill the tank, and it crests just before overflowing.

Sure, I lose some water volume, but to me it isn't worth the risk. I would drill, but my bottom panel is tempered, and I don't want to drill the back panel.

 

[Piscine]

I use a HOB overflow on my 29g. It is a simple u-tube design like the OP's pic, except I don't have a hole in the top of the u-tube. I just feed a piece of air-line into the u-tube before I install it, and suck the air out of the tube, then pull the airline out.

As long as the u-tube is positioned away from the overflow grates (toward the center of the overflow box, so the bubbles created from water falling over the grate doesn't get sucked up in the tube) then there are no issues with breaking the siphon, and no worries about unreliable lift pumps.

 

[Bee0912]

You're right, you don't understand. The Toms Aqua Lifter pump is not bullet proof, and is prone to failure. This causes the siphon to break. Then they stop sending water down to the sump, meanwhile the pump is still pumping to the tank. If you have enough water in the sump, then you get water on the floor. As for the pump making noise, that's great and all, if you're at home 24hrs a day. Some of us do have a life that involves leaving the house every now and then

EDIT: and nobody said anything about them 'emptying' your tank

Your sump it setup wrong then and the samething will happen with your drilled tank. What happens when a fish dies in your tank and covers your drain????

 

[ar0wan]

Your sump it setup wrong then...

Them's fiting werds par'ner

 

[Piscine]

Your sump it setup wrong then and the samething will happen with your drilled tank. What happens when a fish dies in your tank and covers your drain????

He didn't read the thread. If it isn't the way he did it, then its wrong anyway.

 

[jcardona1]

Your sump it setup wrong then and the samething will happen with your drilled tank. What happens when a fish dies in your tank and covers your drain????

do you even know how a sump works?

It has nothing to do with the "setup" of it. Just depends how much excess water you have in there. Me, I don't like to add water to the sump everyday, so I keep extra water in there, which evaporates slowly. If you're using a submersible pump, the MINIMUM water level will depend on the size of your pump, since the pump should be fully submerged. I guess now you're gonna say I bought the wrong pump right?

 

[jcardona1]

Would a good precautionary measure be to set your sump up in a way that it can't drain entirely into your tank should the siphon fail? IE: Maybe having your return draw it's water from near the top of your sump? That way if the siphon breaks, the return pump can only take so much water from the sump and put it back in your show tank?

Yes that would work, but then you have another problem. By having the return near the top of the sump, this means you water must level in the sump must also be at the top right (unless I'm misunderstanding what you're saying)? If that's the case, then you won't have enough room in the sump to catch the excess water that will drain down when the pump is turned off. Because regardless of how you set up an overflow/sump, you will ALWAYS drain a few gallons of water down to the sump after the pump is turned off. You'd be cutting it very close by having a return at the top.