Electric Blue Jack Dempsey Breeding

[oswego]

So if I get some ebjd from two different reliable sources and some bgjd from another two different reliable sources and grow them out I would have a good start on breeding some EBJD with less problems?

 

[cjbarth]

ya should. you will end up with 50% EBJD and 50% BG JD (have blue gene) fry i think.

nn (ebjd) x Nn (blue gene jacks). That should get ya goin!

 

[Bless_ed]

African Cichlids cannot breed with SA/CA Cichlids… they’re evolution is simply too far apart. So it’s definitely not an African/CA hybrid…

The DNA sequencing proves that the maternal (Mother’s) side of Blue Dempseys are 100% Dempsey but proves nothing about the paternal (Father’s) side. But the sequencing went back many more generations than Blue Dempsey have been spawned in captivity, so IF there is any hybridization it took place in the wild many generations before humans got their hands on Blue Dempseys… which doesn’t make sense for a lot of reasons…

So we cannot say we have proven they are not hybrids… but we can say we have scientifically analyzed them and see no reason to suspect they may be hybrids…

To date, no one has ever seen/captured a Blue Dempsey in the wild. But this does not mean they aren’t out there. But what is much more likely to be the situation, the Blue Dempseys die in the wild, not because they are weak, but because they stand out like a sore thumb. Dempseys, fish, animals… are colored the way they are for two primary reasons, A) camouflage, B) impressing the opposite sex. But if a young fish can’t camo itself, it’ll never grow up to impress a mate. Therefore these bright blue little fish don’t ever get a chance to grow up.

What very well could take place though is the Blue coloration is kept alive in the wild via “Blue Gene” Dempseys. These are the regular looking Dempseys that have a recessive gene for the Blue coloration. When two Blue Genes spawn together, 50% of their babies are again Blue Genes. Following this approach the Blue coloration could be kept alive for billions of years without a Blue Dempsey ever spawning.

Back to spawning in the aquarium hobby…

I have personally spawned Blue x Blue using 3 different pairs (3 different males & 3 different females). In every pair the eggs hatched like normal, the wigglers developed into free swimmers like normal… but the free swimmers didn’t develop properly and all died within 3 weeks of being frees swimming. I know of a couple others who had the exact same experience and have only talked to one person who claims they were able to keep some alive for a few months… every one he kept alive was deformed. So for the time being we have to accept Blue x Blue doesn’t work.

This could be because either the Blue gene is a lethal gene… or the current stock of Blue Dempseys are so inbred that without the “fresh Dempsey blood” they cannot survive… or some twisted combination of the two. I don’t really know which it is… and neither does anyone else… and speculation gets us no where…

I do not agree that spawning a Blue Dempsey with an unrelated Blue Gene Dempsey is “irresponsible” but I can say that I have experience that the Blue offspring of BGxBG pairs seem stronger than the Blue offspring of BluexBG pairs… I am currently breeding Blue Dempsey using both approaches…

BluexBG pairs produce (approx) 50% Blue offspring… BGxBG pairs produce (approx) 25% Blue offspring… despite the scientific support… I find a wide variance in actual numbers of Blues produced from pair to pair.

With my last few broods, I’ve been raising my Blue offspring along with the non-Blue offspring for the first 6 weeks. My Blue Dempseys are not following the speculation that they will not survive. I even had one brood where it seemed the strongest Blues were killing off the non Blues.

If you, or others, are considering breeding with profit in mind… I highly suggest you think things all the way through. Since BGxBG pairs only produce 25% Blue Dempseys… you will have 25% sellable stock. So if you breed a fish that is worth 25% as much as a Blue Dempsey… you will break even in income per brood… add to that the fact that the mortality rate of Blue Dempseys is far higher than most others, your likely to loose money.

I’m 2.5 years into breeding Blue Dempseys and haven’t made squat from them yet… and although I am now producing healthy, high quality Blues, I’m producing very small quantities in comparison to what I could produce of another species with the same amount of tank space. It is definitely my passion for this morph that is keeping me going… not any hope for profit…

But if, after reading all my ramblings, you decide to breed Blue Dempseys… Then my foremost suggestion is to AVOID INBREEDING. I am well aware that inbreeding is a common practice in the fish hobby, and I’m not arguing that it shouldn’t be. My argument is that Blue Dempseys have been inbreed way too much over the last dozen years or so. Inbreeding alone may not be bad… but excessive inbreeding is definitely bad. Blue Dempseys have been excessively inbred and we now need to outcross our breeding programs to overcome the excessive inbreeding…

I wish you all the best of luck at breeding strong healthy Blue Dempseys… you’ll need it…

Would You consider selling a few of the BGJDs that you have produced

 

[Stevie p]

After seaching for 3 years and buying over 50 bluejacks from across ontatio, i finally got some BlueGene babies from the best male Blue Jack i have ever seen. Now that i have hundreds of Bluegene babies, i can start breeding them to the other superior male Bluejacks i have aquired over the last 2 years. It is exciting, as so many suppliers bluejacks have clearly been inbreed without any thought to quality!

 

[Szar]

After seaching for 3 years and buying over 50 bluejacks from across ontatio, i finally got some BlueGene babies from the best male Blue Jack i have ever seen. Now that i have hundreds of Bluegene babies, i can start breeding them to the other superior male Bluejacks i have aquired over the last 2 years. It is exciting, as so many suppliers bluejacks have clearly been inbreed without any thought to quality!

where did you buy them ? iv been looking for BGs for some time but no luck.

 

[Stevie p]

Right now my Blue Gene babies are about 1.5 inches long, and growing agressively! It will be nice to have offspring and be able to show not only mom and dad, but grandma and grandpa as well. Gone are the days of buying inbred overpriced babies with bent deformed heads, none functioning fins and genetically weak Bluejacks. I have a 125 gal with 21 Bluejack males ranging in size from 6-7 inches. Also I have several 75 gallon tanks with my best males, waiting for the Bluegene females to get big enough. I have selected only the best males to include in the breeding program.
If you have any questions, you can email me at stephenpanas@hotmail.com

 

[Szar]

Right now my Blue Gene babies are about 1.5 inches long, and growing agressively! It will be nice to have offspring and be able to show not only mom and dad, but grandma and grandpa as well. Gone are the days of buying inbred overpriced babies with bent deformed heads, none functioning fins and genetically weak Bluejacks. I have a 125 gal with 21 Bluejack males ranging in size from 6-7 inches. Also I have several 75 gallon tanks with my best males, waiting for the Bluegene females to get big enough. I have selected only the best males to include in the breeding program.
If you have any questions, you can email me at stephenpanas@hotmail.com

Nice set up.

do you sale any of them ? or are all for your breeding program.

 

[Stevie p]

I purchased about 30 regular jack dempseys, then selected the best 4 females to breed to my best male bluejack (he is awsome, with green, yellow overtones on top of the blue). I will try to post a picture of him. 2 months ago they had babies, and a month later they did it again.
I have another really nice 6.5 inch male bluejack in a 75 gallon with 5 regular jack females. They have been together for about 3 months, and nothing yet.

 

[Szar]

I purchased about 30 regular jack dempseys, then selected the best 4 females to breed to my best male bluejack (he is awsome, with green, yellow overtones on top of the blue). I will try to post a picture of him. 2 months ago they had babies, and a month later they did it again.
I have another really nice 6.5 inch male bluejack in a 75 gallon with 5 regular jack females. They have been together for about 3 months, and nothing yet.

Nice, you could set up a hell of a line if things go well.

If you ever plan to sale any BGs or ebjd i'm up to buy some.

iv found adding some fish of another species helps with forming a pair, they team up faster to fight them of. My jewel's just laid eggs after being in the same tank for 3/4 weeks.

 

[Stevie p]

I think it will be hard to buy bluegene, because that would be like selling the goose that lays golden eggs. Also if buy them from someone you will not be sure of their quality, or if they are inbreed or if they even carry the blue gene for sure. I spent way too much money on garbage Bluejacks, that were definitly not worth breeding. It is definitly a trial and error thing. As i said, it took buying bluejacks from several, several places (wholesale and retail), before i got really awsome bluejack males. I still have several male bluejacks that are nice that are kept as a display in a 125 gal, because they look great as a school, but i will only breed the very best. After all, i have over 50 male bluejacks, and with each pair expected to yeild 50-100 bluejacks, not all of them need to be breeders.