F3 P14

[DavidW]

T1.
F3 is simply an extrapolation of the principle, and is the result of breeding brother and sister F2. I don;t care much about what Asian aro breeders are doing. Apples and Oranges imo.
There is no reason for an informational thread to ever get closed unless someone starts name calling ( please check your last post T1) . If the conversation remains civil there is no problem. I have said nothing here to insult you, I simply asked you a relevant question that you could have easily answered without any ad-hominem comments!

Well done on your successful ray breeding. I sincerely hope they make it .

T1
Please excuse my obvious ignorance . You have spoken passionately against breeding brother with sister in other threads, and I am confused.
As we cannot (for whatever reason) seem to agree on what the biology definition of F1 F2 F3 Fetc etc means , would you please tell us the family tree and parental relationships of your new pups. I am genuinely interested in their heritage and what may happen with them. You, as their breeder/keeper are the only person in a position to give this information. I am interested in learning reliable information, if you provide it. I'm not so interested in defensive rationalizations for deliberate ignorance. If they are at the F3 definition as I have used it they can perhaps provide some answers about what happens to them as the effects of recessive genes are inevitably exposed by massive inbreeding

 

[T1KARMANN]

T1.
F3 is simply an extrapolation of the principle, and is the result of breeding brother and sister F2. I don;t care much about what Asian aro breeders are doing. Apples and Oranges imo.
There is no reason for an informational thread to ever get closed unless someone starts name calling ( please check your last post T1) . If the conversation remains civil there is no problem. I have said nothing here to insult you, I simply asked you a relevant question that you could have easily answered without any ad-hominem comments!

Well done on your successful ray breeding. I sincerely hope they make it .

T1
Please excuse my obvious ignorance . You have spoken passionately against breeding brother with sister in other threads, and I am confused.
As we cannot (for whatever reason) seem to agree on what the biology definition of F1 F2 F3 Fetc etc means , would you please tell us the family tree and parental relationships of your new pups. I am genuinely interested in their heritage and what may happen with them. You, as their breeder/keeper are the only person in a position to give this information. I am interested in learning reliable information, if you provide it. I'm not so interested in defencive rationalisations for deliberate ignorance. If they are at the F3 definition as I have used it they can perhaps provide some answers about what happens to them as the effects of recessive genes are inevitably exposed by massive inbreeding

maybe if you didn't come across as more of a ass than me maybe people would take more note of what you say

maybe i should word the thread different maybe i should have posted F2 and beyond P14

it doesn't matter what i called them as both pups are now dead as i expected

maybe if you were not to intrested to nit pick on the title of the thread and put some of your vast knowledge into the thread then maybe you could have helped with some good input

i am still against inter breeding and the parants come from totaly diffrerent blood lines

 

[Ade]

Sorry they didn't make it. U did everything u possibly could mate..

 

[crystal clear exotics]

sorry they didnt make it bro.. over here on the other side of the pond f0 wild. regardless if its a pair or a single fish its f0. f1 is fry from 2 f0 fish, if 2 f1 fish have offsrping wow u have f2. if 2 f2 have fry f3. the onl question i have that if a f1 and a f2 have fry is that f 1.5 lol. im with u bro internet bullies. love to see them in person. hopefully next time your breeding will be a go. i know how u feel. hopefully u will have f10 one day

 

[balvaro]

Sorry...

Now we are all expecting for the next time!

Congrats for keeping the parents properly!
They will breed successfully next time!

 

[tencc]

Richard so sorry that the pups didn't make it.
At least u can take comfort that the mama is doing fine now.
All the best.

 

[sharp tooth]

you now have your breeding trio again mate.

sad to hear the last one dident make it but it was expected.
wont be long and they will be at it again im sure.

 

[fastfreddy]

Sorry for your loss. Look at the bright side. Your rays are on their way to making lots of pups in the future. I still say congrats to you with this accomplishment.

 

[DavidW]

maybe if you didn't come across as more of a ass than me maybe people would take more note of what you say

maybe i should word the thread different maybe i should have posted F2 and beyond P14

it doesn't matter what i called them as both pups are now dead as i expected

maybe if you were not to intrested to nit pick on the title of the thread and put some of your vast knowledge into the thread then maybe you could have helped with some good input

i am still against inter breeding and the parants come from totaly diffrerent blood lines

I am not sure what you think I could add that others haven't already said that you wouldn't reflexively take as some kind of attack on you. And yet again you can't stop yourself from making personal attacks and name calling. This is regrettable. I am trying to keep it civil, despite my signature. I haven't said a single word to attack you. please at least make an attempt to do the same.

As already stated, premature pups are always going to be in trouble.
I am sorry that yours died. I know how depressing that can be.

Don't you think that it is important that we are all on the same page when it comes to using biological technical terms. Otherwise, just like this thread, we are talking across each other, like speaking a different language. And to this end shouldn't we be best served by using these terms in their generally accepted scientific meaning instead of inventing our own nonsensical versions? Just asking!

If the parents are from totally different bloodlines then they become F0 and their pups are F1, by any definition, whether I am an ass or not is irrelevant.

 

[StefanW]

If the parents are from totally different bloodlines then they become F0 and their pups are F1, by any definition, whether I am an ass or not is irrelevant.

So if a F2 male of a certain bloodline which must contain some kind of inbreed if the term is used biologically or scientifically correct, is combined with a F2 female of another certain bloodline, these two animals are F0 and their pups F1 again, although, if for example already their grandparents have been F0 (but wildcaught F0) and their parents also already have been F1?

Or is the combination of this unrelated F2 male and female a F2 pair and do those pups of the two unrelated F2 strains have to be called F3, cause they are the third generation which was born in captivity?

Which term should be used, both seem to be some kind of correct, if I understood Andreas right, although if I would prefer to define it like David does!