Fish Buyers YEAH YOU

[AQUATiC213ZOMBiE]

WELL SAiD ODDBALLLER!!!!
whoooooooooooo


stop being conceited ppl~
hahhaa


this hobby is damn expensive.
and very work oriented.

i've only ordered snails online bcuz its the cheapest price for it and shipping.

but, if i had enough tank space and money to order online.
i wouldnt trip on Vendors...
bcuz im ballin enough to take a loss.

besides, just like the man said.
People that sell fish, sell them for the joy of it, they dont get so much out of it. (like Oddball Being Worshipped like some fish deity~ ROFL j'k )



i'd also like to add that...
all those reasons can be accounted as the same risks we take when buying a fish at our LFS.
except the fact that, they tend to hook u up with another one, or a discount.

but a flight from another state~
means a plastic bag filled with Oxygen, water, and a fish.
inside of a box... is sent from airport to airport.

you never know when a Mahalalalala will hi-jack the airplane with your precious prized specimen.

Or Tim the box mover 'accidentily' throws your box without a care.

Or even quite possibly the quantum physics of the air pressure and altitude will puncture the bag and kill your fish.



lol j'k. but yeah guys.
Cut The Vendors Some Slack.
they're doing the best they can to deal with us insane crazy MFkeepers.

-ZMB!E-

i MEANT ODDBALLER.
whoops.

 

[shoefreak03]

i can agree with Oddballer's and some of the other vendors point of view. it has hard to please everyone. i guess there are 2 sides of the story in every business, the customers point of view and the sellers point of view.

i've ordered from a few vendors by them shipping to me and some by local pick ups. some turned out perfect and some minor issues, nothing to get crazy about. its all part of this hobby unfortunately. most minor things were fix by the seller when they have control over. some sellers go out of their way to make the transaction as perfect as possible.

imo, terms should be posted somewhere that all buyers can see what they are. if a seller chooses are minimun order of x amount, it is completely up to them. it kind of useless to order 1 $20 fish and have it shipped across the country which adds an extra $60-80. the seller is probably only making a few bucks, not even worth the time to pack, drive to airport to drop off and then drive back. their time is money just like everyone elses. i am sure some of you wouldn't drive 2 hours to buy a fish that is pretty common because it isnt worth your time unless you are truely a hard core fish hobbiest.

if the seller does not have live arrival, and the buyer is afraid to lose out, then do purchase from the seller. clear and simple. fishes die sometimes. it's a common thing. sometimes common couriers are very unreliable (UPS, FedEx, DHL, etc) everyone know that. they kick the boxes around and probably mistreat it during transit. is this the sellers fault?? nope. this is something they have no control over. buyer choose this method. i've have fishes shipped to door and also to my closest airport. trust me, airport is much better way but it does take time from the buy to go get it but keep in mind sometimes packages does get lost and flights do get delayed.

some fish takes time to get to their comfort level after shipping and settle in. some get pass it and some don't. fishes do get stress as they die. this is not the sellers fault either unless the fish was really sick with diseases when you received it.

i've seen people complain about the size of fishes. unless you were expecting a 12" and getting a 8" instead, then this is something to be discussed with the seller but if you ordered a 12" fish and it comes in 11", this is stupid to bring up and bad mouth the seller. even when you go to a LFS, not all fishes are the same size.
i've order fishes expecting it to be 4" and got 3" instead. no big deal. it will grow 1" in no time.

most people on this forum are hard core fish keepers, spending crazy money to get their hands on some rare fishes. honestly, sometimes you do need to know some people to help get some rare fishes. burning bridges is not the way to do this cause one day that seller may get in the one fish you were searching for with no success and all of a sudden all the past issues and past posting of " i will never order from this vendor again" or "don't purchases from this vendor" becomes a vague memory.

i am not a vendor, a customer like most of the people here. a hobbiest to this fish hobby. my advise is not to jump to conclusion and blame the seller for every little thing that goes wrong. most of the vendors are very helpful (the ones i've dealt with thus far). some of the vendors are very experience in terms of knowledge of the fishes. dont get angry cause the seller are not as responsive and at your call at the drop of a dime because they are busy, just like you are at times. while your trying to take their time, they are probably busy setting up another buyers order. if you really have a bad experience, where they seller stole your money, then yes, post away. warn fellow members about this issue so no one else loses any money to the seller. if the shipment came in 1" smaller, let it go, dont bash the seller cause this takes you off their future orders. if the fishes arrives DOA during transit, this is not a reason to come to the board and tell everyone the seller is bad without first working it out with the seller.

i've sold fishes also. i can understand some of the frustrations. the person tells you yea, i want the fish. dont sell it to anyone else. later then says i changed my mind or the worst one i've heard is which is, i found a seller selling this x amount less than you (after research, the other seller is in another country). wtf

buyer does have too much control. if the buyer has bad experience, dont purchase from them again. move on. it is your choice who you give your money to. if they are truely what you think they are, eventually they will be out of this business with bad business practices. one bad experience from one buyer does not mean all transactions are bad.

BOTTOM LINE as a buyer and as a seller, you have to use good judgement. enjoy this hobby. it is just FISH.

some of you may agree with me, some may not. it really doesnt matter. just wanted to share my experiences.

 

[ewurm]

When you buy online, the margins are much, much lower. The seller is making much less money per order. You can't expect the same level of service that you get at your lfs. They operate on volume, most individual customers place orders that are very low profit. You can't have it both ways. If service is more important to you, then you have to pay for it.

 

[Haag13]

I've only been in the hobby a short time, but none the less, I'm thoroughly addicted. I've already spent thousands of dollars on equipment and fish and there is no end in sight. I'm very fortunate to live in an area where I do have some large local fish stores that have large amounts of fish and always stock some oddballs(that pet place in lancaster, and world wide aquarium in upper darby). My first experience with ordering fish online was not the best. The fish were only coming from the next state over but one fish arrived dead and the other had one foot in the grave and another on a banana peel(if fish had feet I suppose). I was home to receive the fish and when they arrived the water felt like it was about 40F. When I told the vendor the situation, he became defensive immediately and said that he had packaged and shipped correctly and it wasn't his fault. Obviously, he had not. I see a lot of people slamming buyers for complaining that the fish arrived dead when it was freezing cold outside. Why slam the buyer? I know 1/10th of what the dealer knows about fish so if he says he can get the fish to me alive and guarantee them, who am I to tell him different? I'm a very fair guy. When I enter an agreement, I hold my end of the deal up. I may not be important to the vendor and I am a low volume buyer, but I don't think that gives anyone the right to blow me off. I didn't like the vendor's attitude towards the situation at first but I thought about it for a while and bit the bullet. I figured, I never would have had the chance to own this fish if this guy wasn't out there selling them. I requested a refund for one of the fish(both were essentially dead) and was surprised when he immediatly refunded me for it. I realized that we were both being so damn defensive to start that we didn't give each other the chance to find out we weren't trying to f*** the other guy over. That transaction was done on aquabid before I ever learned of this site(only a couple weeks ago.) I've since found this site, found out tons of like-minded hobbyists, found tons of information, and realized that the vender I bought from on AB is also a big vendor here. I hate to sound like a hippy, but the negativity to start the transaction really made the whole deal much worse than it had to be. Even though both fish died, I wouldn't hesitate to buy from the vendor again. After all, if it wasn't for the vendors, I'd only have some sunfish and bass available to me, and if it weren't for the buyers....there wouldn't be vendors. Everyone needs to remember why they started in this hobby to begin with and be as understanding as possible when the situation allows it. And like others have already said in this thread, if the buyer or seller really doesn't do good business, think of it as a lesson learned and don't do business with them again. In the infamous words of Reginald Denny......Can't we all just get along? lol

 

[shoefreak03]

I've only been in the hobby a short time, but none the less, I'm thoroughly addicted. I've already spent thousands of dollars on equipment and fish and there is no end in sight. I'm very fortunate to live in an area where I do have some large local fish stores that have large amounts of fish and always stock some oddballs(that pet place in lancaster, and world wide aquarium in upper darby). My first experience with ordering fish online was not the best. The fish were only coming from the next state over but one fish arrived dead and the other had one foot in the grave and another on a banana peel(if fish had feet I suppose). I was home to receive the fish and when they arrived the water felt like it was about 40F. When I told the vendor the situation, he became defensive immediately and said that he had packaged and shipped correctly and it wasn't his fault. Obviously, he had not. I see a lot of people slamming buyers for complaining that the fish arrived dead when it was freezing cold outside. Why slam the buyer? I know 1/10th of what the dealer knows about fish so if he says he can get the fish to me alive and guarantee them, who am I to tell him different? I'm a very fair guy. When I enter an agreement, I hold my end of the deal up. I may not be important to the vendor and I am a low volume buyer, but I don't think that gives anyone the right to blow me off. I didn't like the vendor's attitude towards the situation at first but I thought about it for a while and bit the bullet. I figured, I never would have had the chance to own this fish if this guy wasn't out there selling them. I requested a refund for one of the fish(both were essentially dead) and was surprised when he immediatly refunded me for it. I realized that we were both being so damn defensive to start that we didn't give each other the chance to find out we weren't trying to f*** the other guy over. That transaction was done on aquabid before I ever learned of this site(only a couple weeks ago.) I've since found this site, found out tons of like-minded hobbyists, found tons of information, and realized that the vender I bought from on AB is also a big vendor here. I hate to sound like a hippy, but the negativity to start the transaction really made the whole deal much worse than it had to be. Even though both fish died, I wouldn't hesitate to buy from the vendor again. After all, if it wasn't for the vendors, I'd only have some sunfish and bass available to me, and if it weren't for the buyers....there wouldn't be vendors. Everyone needs to remember why they started in this hobby to begin with and be as understanding as possible when the situation allows it. And like others have already said in this thread, if the buyer or seller really doesn't do good business, think of it as a lesson learned and don't do business with them again. In the infamous words of Reginald Denny......Can't we all just get along? lol

good thing the vendor actually gave you a refund for one fish. that is a good thing.

was there heat packs in the box? what mode for shipping (airport to airport or to door?). vendor and buyer should know when it is cold weather, heat packs are required especially in the east coast.

 

[jelkel]

Work in retail. It happens everyday someone tries to screw you one way or the other, or they don't like how their being treated and they want something for nothing or a discount. It is part of doing business, but people that don't work in a service oriented business don't
understand how it is (dealing with the public) and that your trying to please dozens, if not hundreds of customers a day. I treat customers like I would like to be treated--Honestly! I understand both sides, but if you don't know what a business/service person goes through daily, it's not really fair to bash them in an open format.
A few more things...
-There's two sides to every story...
-Everyone has their opion/ viewpoint on how something happened...
-Don't let the 1% wreck 99% of your day!
Oh yea, have a nice day!

 

[mike dunagan]

I have yet to do the vendor buy. I have done a few buys where I drive hours and pick it up and I just did an order from another hobbyist who sells a few different fish he raises. I am an experienced person with dealing with the public. I have worked retail for years and not always in the best area of towns. So you have to be careful who you challenge or you may get shot. Now that I live in a lot safer area I became a teacher. Talk about only hear oneside and get yelled at. I have a parent chew me out for asking her daughter to come to the office for telling me to stay out of her F**** business. I am a dean ( I do school discpline and teach) and talk to parents often. I am a great person who is friendly and understanding. However, when the phone rings or you call a customer back (parent) you never know what you will get. I hate the hello, followed by words I can not repeat in high pitch helling. After talking for awhile most of the time it works out okay. Other times people believe that they are being lied to and that we are always out to get them.

Now applying this to the thread (its healthy to vent for a teacher)you never know how long the vendor was yelled at before your call, or the crap they deal with. If you call and are understandable about the limited time they have and be kind and get straight to the point. They will treat you right. Act like an A** and they will get defensive. You can only get yelled at so much in one day. As for vendors to customers. If you are having a bad day or a bad call, remember the next call is not that person. They have no clue the crap you deal with. Be kind and follow your policy to a T and you will make money. Hell we make policies so we can follow them. Otherwise why waste the time coming up with them. Face it in life we all get screwed. Be kind take yours and say thank you. One day you will be the one dishing it out...

Sorry for the rant. This is why I go to 10 petstores a week. I can see and buy only what I want. It saves money when you buy what you want. Unless you are most of the guys I know who buy 100 fish regularly. I have 15 tanks and only buy a few a week. (not many are under 55) I feel better now.

 

[Fish Finder]

With the recent drama about certain vendors I decided to express my view on the whole "online" sales situation and transactions....... I'll state the facts as i see em..... so many of you reading may not like what i'm about to say..... but "if the cap fits".......

Before the internet fish hobbyist were like detectives when trying to find certain species.... rushing into the LFS on shipment days to see whats new..... i remember going through my phone book and calling up 10 different "petstores" hoping to find a FW snowflake eel..... Finally SCORE i found one.... I only had to drive 3hrs to pick it up..... Nowadays all you have to do is scroll through a couple forums or email a vendor to see if they have what your looking for on their suppliers list......

As some of you may remember i used to sell fish online as well...... due to my fragile ego i wanted to make a name for myself online.... and figured that was the best way to do so....... I honestly thought i was Robin hood.... giving back to the fish community with great prices and hard to get species..... My ego inflated..... letters of gratitude and pictures of my fish were posted up everwhere...... it was fun...... I knew i was not going to get rich selling "oddballs"..... the risks were higher and the markup was smaller...... but still i did it cuz it was fun..... I even used to give away free fish with every purchase........ I spent countless hours playing email tag and juggling phone calls...... I even sent many people fish before payment because i trusted you guys...... sure i got burnt acouple times....... but it was all worth it.... because " I WAS THE MAN!!!"

As the months went by the novelty of admiration amongst my peers wore off........ I started to see a trend amongst the customers...... i had many "smaller" who would get together "group orders" to save on freight..... that was fine but it took alot of work packing and seperating individual shipments....... pretty soon what i was doing for liesure became work..... it seemed like i just was not able to satisfy certain customers no matter what i tried...... but yet they keep buying..... and with every purchase i had problems with this or that...... it got to a point where i had to cut off certain people becaue the were "killing my buzz"....... Then i noticed that these same people had problems with other vendors too.....

I worked fish retail for 11yrs.... and sold cars for 6months prior to going into the wholesale side of the industry....... one thing i noticed was that some people walk around with a pinched sphincter always...... no matter how genuine your trying to be...... they believe that eveyone is out to get them....... they think that they are the most important person the whole world....... perhaps they're right...... to them they are...... but don't expect everyone to believe that as well....... back to my original point..... I noticed that the majority of "online" customers fall into this category... (YEAH YOU)....... i came up with a theory as to why........

Lets take the car biz for instance....... the most (pain in the arse) customers are the one's who come in with a stack of papers.... printing quotes and specs frome a dozen different dealerships shopping for the best deal...... finally ending up saving a few hundred dollars but spending twice as much in TIME AND MONEY...... thats why the leave getting a "good deal" on paper but still have that "not so fresh feeling"...... Well YOU guys are very similar...... spending hours of time online researching and shopping for that "monster" that your LFS won't carry...... you cannot expect a vendor to have the same amount of emotional attachment to each shipment like you do.......

In a perfect world fish don't die and airline do not make mistakes........ but Atlantis is underwater and earth has "union workers"....... Many times people don't consider the risks the vendor takes on every shipment....... Delays, mishandling, bag puntures are all "normal" in the fish biz...... I lose thousands every week due to factors out of my control....... its all part of my business..... its called shrinkage...... The supplier should absorb the majority of this.... its their business to do so....... but some people expect too much.......

"oh the fish was .5" smaller that you said" or "the fish died in a week" or "it didnt eat right away when i put it in my tank" or my personal favorite...... "it got killed by its tankmates"...... A vendor can have a perfect track record only to get it derailed by one bad transaction....... I remember a time when i was selling Arapaima Gigas for $20...... I had one guy flame me online because i wasnt able to save him any....... another one of my favorites is when a customer begs me to order a certain fish..... and when i do...... "oh i don't have room"......

Anyways the point i'm trying to make is YOU need to cut the vendor some slack at times....... your not that important!!!!! they are doing their best they can at that time....... No one functions at 100% 24/7..... some times you need to meet them halfway because they have already taken losses to be able to provide you with the opportunity to buy fish online.......

just my .03cents.......

I agree with u 100%. Very few people online know that i am actually a wholesaler of saltwater fish. The reason why is because i see all the bull**** the online vender's have to deal with and actually it scares the crap out of me. When dealing with store's i get a list from them every week and i deliver of ship it with in two day's. I offer a 10% DOA guarantee meaning if 10% or more of the fish arrive DOA the store will be credited on there next order. I have yet to have a claim. I know if i were to deal with the public unlike the stores they will stress every DOA that shows up. But no one realize how much we risk and what we have already eaten in our DOA's. In a average 20 box order is about 2/3 DOA. With another 1/2 that will go within the next day. Now remember we payed for the fish as well as the shipping and do we get our money back by calling the diver and saying HEY i lost one box of fish NO. Some time's i bring in some higher end items and sell them retail to the few people that know me well on the forums and knows what i get but that is as far as i am willing to go.

 

[neoprodigy]

should i post my 2cent?

 

[Miguel]

yes, why not? go ahead, please.