Thanks thats a very useful web, i already know it.about the gts, i have wild ones, males get up to 45cm and females 35cm, im not lying, theres a type of association in the other side of the river shore, that have native fish of the river, they have a pair of white saum(male 44cm and female 33cm) 14years old since they were caught at 6cm, a pair of gold saum(male 45cm and female 35cm) they are 16years old, male at 8cm and female at 5cm, pair of red terror (male 55cm and female 40cm) 13years old since caught, male at 4cm and female 7cm. and lots of enormous plecs, 2meters RTC or bagre as they call them here, variety of aequidens, guppies, and other fish.
Sorry cant take pics of them, cams are not allowed in the reservation room of the fishies

. But i really dont want my whitesaum pair to get that big.
Ps. Carlos say that they grow that big cause the guayas river like many rivers in the coast region of Ecuador have manglares that are big air trees that grow over mud at river shores where crabbies live and they produce an special component that give vitality and proteins and other weird named stuff to fish when they are fries (all fish of the river go to the "manglares" that are all over the river shores to spawn under the mud and roots, the crabbies are in danger cause they try to eat the eggs but the parents of the eggs eat them if they come out.)