going to try breeding clown loaches
- Thread starter wild bill
- Start date
Having said that, does MFK get groups together for travel discounts for such "fact finding" excursions?
Alright and this all is going to go against the grain here compared to nearly all fish, but seeing how no one has done it with pictures to document, here we go:
When pairs are formed for clowns, are they for life or a one time deal? Also how are these formed
That brackish comment had me think, we established that the water changes, but maybe it is that type of change where they move from slight salt to completely fresh. I would think there would groups that also breed far enough up any river where this wouldnt be the case but who knows.
And lastly, and this is just a what if, but maybe there is a (for lack of a better word) chemical they release that when present in mass quantities (and thus said a mass quantity of clowns would have to be present) is what helps trigger spawning and therefor hasn't been able to be recreated in an aquarium.
For example, I know that some fish do release something like that which sometimes is what determines size/limits max size potential of fish in a lake over actual available food. What happens is the more fish there are the more chemicals there is, and as a result the smaller they all stay, however when there is less fish less is present in the water, and they can get larger. However I am wondering if there is a similar but different one for spawning that needs to be in large quantities.
Although this may not be true at all if people have attempted this in lakes/hatcherys/etc with lots of them and still failed? I am not the read up on this subject.
Obviously there are many factors that all have to line up and no one has gotten them to happen all at once yet, either on purpose or accident.
When pairs are formed for clowns, are they for life or a one time deal? Also how are these formed
That brackish comment had me think, we established that the water changes, but maybe it is that type of change where they move from slight salt to completely fresh. I would think there would groups that also breed far enough up any river where this wouldnt be the case but who knows.
And lastly, and this is just a what if, but maybe there is a (for lack of a better word) chemical they release that when present in mass quantities (and thus said a mass quantity of clowns would have to be present) is what helps trigger spawning and therefor hasn't been able to be recreated in an aquarium.
For example, I know that some fish do release something like that which sometimes is what determines size/limits max size potential of fish in a lake over actual available food. What happens is the more fish there are the more chemicals there is, and as a result the smaller they all stay, however when there is less fish less is present in the water, and they can get larger. However I am wondering if there is a similar but different one for spawning that needs to be in large quantities.
Although this may not be true at all if people have attempted this in lakes/hatcherys/etc with lots of them and still failed? I am not the read up on this subject.
Obviously there are many factors that all have to line up and no one has gotten them to happen all at once yet, either on purpose or accident.
Some body some where is doing because if wild caught cannot be shipped under 4 inches how do we get inch and a half ones in the pet stores. We have about 7 in our almost brackish tank and they are doing fine so maybe they could live that way for a growth period then go home to spawn. The hormone in the tank should be easy because a tank is miute compared to a lake mean far less cl's needed to saturate the water. That is unless we should leave the tank sit in that condition longer than we would for a normal water change. As I mentioned earlier I think they are alot tougher than we believe. A thought I had tonight could we simulate a peat bog by covering the bottom of a tank with several inches of peat moss. Then planting it and adding a pile of driftwood. Then warm the tank to about 84, 85 degrees use a bubble filter so there is very little water movment like the end of the dry season. Now add some small native fish of the area and see what happens. This should simulate a bog or lake near the end of the dry season and maybe spur a breeding.
Wild Bill, They ban the export of clowns OVER 4 inches, not under. The idea being that they are getting close to breeding size by then.
Clown House;5129497; said:
Although I have seen new clowns being imported that are over 4". Not sure exactly how that is happening--if they are growing them out stateside or what.
WildBill, near brackish? I'll admit I've not found/read much on the actual habitat of CL and they seem to be much more salt tolerant than other loaches, but the consensus on husbandry is warm, clean, flowing water and lots of it. I don't mean to sound preachy, but don't put the cart before the horse. Get the loaches fat & happy under known habitat conditions (riverine) then start tinkering with breeding.
Then begin at the beginning, with the tried & true of related loaches: a massive water change over short period with mild decrease in temperature. Simulate rainy season, then migration, then migration in rainy season blah blah blah. Then start trying variations or extremes on this theme before you get truly creative.
Maybe also check UofC- they might have some tropical people in the Eco/Bio/Limnology dept. who might be helpful.
Then begin at the beginning, with the tried & true of related loaches: a massive water change over short period with mild decrease in temperature. Simulate rainy season, then migration, then migration in rainy season blah blah blah. Then start trying variations or extremes on this theme before you get truly creative.
Maybe also check UofC- they might have some tropical people in the Eco/Bio/Limnology dept. who might be helpful.
I looked up Borneo on Google maps. Quite a surprise, seems the entire country is covered in snow.
Sorry about the goof up on the size thing there must of misintirprited. That is odd what you found I thought Borneo was all jungle as that is where the orangutan is from. This info would indicate there must be some cold water moving about at sometime of the year one would think. May be the runoff is what triggers the spawn and who knows what food could come down in that cold water. There could be fry from salmon like fish or maybe even a flood of fresh water shrimp which I know ours love to eat. I still think maybe some of what we are being told about the cl is maybe to prevent the aquarium spawning. Would be an effective way of keeping a monopoly on the sales market as this advice does not hurt the loaches it just prevents the spawning cycle of their life. Like I have said ours have been really resiliant tough fish showing no stress where other tough fish have. This is why I swwm leary to believe all we are being told about them.
