i dont care if you hate me for this

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And dogofwar, you're the unofficial fishclub promoter, riddle me this... What is the point in some of these cichlid clubs across the country that have members breeding rare cichlids we can't get anywhere, and then hoarding them? If you're not "in", good luck with them even bothering to reply to an email.


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its a shame guys but i will tell you this from my 33 years on this planet. DOUCHE BAGS walk amongst us lol, its true I have met many along my travels and these "clubs" have also been infiltrated with the d bags too, sad fact but the only thing you can count on from other humans is that you cant count on anyone..
 
I don't order from rapps any more because I had horrible customer service from him when I just tried to get my money back on a fish that came dead.

Let's be fair, his live arrival and refund policy are very clearly posted on his website.
http://www.tangledupincichlids.com/order.html
"Any credit due will be awarded on your next order-no cash refunds."

So that's pretty much on you or anyone else... If you don't agree with the policy, you shouldn't order.


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To be completly fair TUIC's policy is clearly stated as "no cash refunds". You can't order fish (or anything for that matter) and not be aware of the terms and condition of sale you agreed to. That can't be called terribile customer service.
 
DOA's are a unfortunate fact in fish keeping, is there seriouslly noone near you that has quality fish , like driving for a couple hours could avoid the whole flight thing, i dunno what you guys use but i haev a thingy that plugs into my lighter socket , i plug in an air pump run lines to the rubbermaid tote in the back of the suburban and I havent had any DOA's that way.. however i have had a 14 inch florida gar come launching into the front seat rocketing down the hwy at 100 kph, so both have risks.. aside from nearly soiling myself both the gar and i survived
 
I believe you have my confused with somebody else my initials are SS, yes I am obviously involved with this hobby, I don't believe you have to collect to get the real deal that's not necessary or practical, my point is you can get the same fish (for the most part) from other sources for much cheaper prices and just because its stated as wild doesn't mean that...like dogowar stated aquarium events are a great and easy way to get nice fish...
 
Heres a thing i noticed. Your complaining about rapps fish being expensive? He doesnt have a minimum amount you have to spend. So he is going to mark his fish up a little bit so he can still make money. Cichlidconnection and such, they have a minimum amount of around $100 so there fish will be marked a little lower. Because there still going to make at least $100 per order. Rapps doesnt always make at least $100 per order.


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Let me give you a perspective from a hobbyist breeder standpoint, and I just discussed this with Jeff Rapps via email a few weeks ago.

I enjoy working with rare and unusual cichlids. They're not always super rare, but uncommon enough that you don't walk into an LFS and see them. For the past five years I have been breeding and raising F1 fish from wild-caught stock and offering them here, on various other cichlid forums, Aquabid, etc. I have ended up culling large percentages of almost every batch of fish I've raised because I cannot sell them, and I do not have endless amounts of tank space to grow out hundreds of fish to 3 - 6" sizes. The same fish can appear on Rapps' list as wild-caught and he will sell them. He has the reputation, he has the larger customer base, and he offers a wide range of species so that people can order multiple fish at once. I cannot offer that in most cases, and the same can be said for most hobbyist breeders.

A few years ago when everyone was buying up notatus severums, I was fortunate enough to get a wild pair and raise F1s. I tried selling 2" fry at $10 each, then $5, then I was basically saying, "These fish are free if you pay the $15 priority mail shipping." I sold maybe 20 fish out of 100. The rest ended up in my freezer. I no longer breed them. Yet people email me all the time and say, "Where can I get this fish?" I always say, "Try Jeff Rapps."

There is a guy in Tampa right now breeding and raising F1s of two highly sought-after fish for SA keepers: Geophagus winemilleri and Retroculus lapidifer. Retroculus were going for $50 - 100 each just a few months ago for wild-caughts. I have watched this guy's auctions week in and week out, and I have yet to see him sell one batch of fry, even though they're priced significantly less than the wild juveniles sold for.

So to answer your question, yes, there may be hobbyists out there breeding and raising certain fish, but it's very hard to move large numbers of fish without the reputation and large online presence of someone like Jeff Rapps, Wet Spot, etc. This is why a lot of hobbyist breeders either raise very small, limited numbers and trade them among fellow hobbyists who are interested, or they raise spawns to 1" and then sell the entire spawn wholesale to Jeff Rapps and let him worry about finding homes for them. Jeff has told me on more than one occasion that he'd gladly take F1 fry from me if it's something uncommon or nice. This is why people like me recommend Rapps -- chances are if he doesn't have wilds, he has F1s which came from his own pairs or a hobbyist breeder like me. Either way, it's usually the most reliable way to find something you're looking for.

Otherwise, like someone else said, you have to do the work yourself -- call LFS, post wanted ads online, browse Aquabid, browse the trading post section of ACA -- hunt for it.
 
Maybe if people didn't post pointless threads like this then people would be nicer on here. This place has been like forever and until you learn how to filter the real advice over the BS then you'll enjoy your time much more and actually learn something. A lot of people get tired of the ignorance of those who post threads all the time only wanting to hear the response they were looking for in the first place...


People suggest rapps cause he is the best and its very simple. You can look up most any thread for someone looking for a rarer cichlid and the rapps name will come up and its not o be snooty or part of the fan club. Its because again.... He's the best.


C'mon man... You've been on here long enough and you should know how this place works by now. Time to grow up ad get over it.



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ok mom :(
 
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