Interesting read for those who feed fish multiple times a day

[neutrino]

...Add ignorance of basic fish nutrition, especially regarding protein. Some forums dedicated to a particular species are self-pollinating regarding care, creating or perpetuating misconceptions, including higher protein requirements for some species than is supported by biology, aquaculture science, or the natural history of the species.

 

[RD.]

Some excellent points neutrino.

Matt - I feed young adults, and adults, once a day, and never feed on water change days. I also feed sparingly, and generally never feed high protein or foods that are high in fat. (except when feeding fry) Fry and juveniles have higher metabolisms, so when I was breeding I tried to feed young fish a minimum of twice a day.

 

[philipraposo1982]

I am shocked after reading this whole thread that no one actually states how much they feed their fish..

I feed alot of I feed small.amount means nothing.

Weight your fish and weight out the food. List the type of food and state how often you feed. This is information that matters.

There should be some general rules of how much we feed based on body mass of our fish. Then we can factor in other variables that will be different for each case and adjust to what we feel best with.

I have no idea what the actual amounts should be but I will read through the article and see if there is any suggestions.

I can also weigh my fish and his food to give an actual idea of what I feed.

I also want to add that stating how long you been in the hobby doesn't matter to me. But if you can post about a fish that you kept alive for 10+ years it would definitely prove you know something about fish keeping in my opinion.

I know many people who drive and have been since 16 but they are terrible at it and I wouldn't get in the car with them if paid too. Amount of time generally means you have experience but doesn't mean you have mastered anything. Doing something wrong for 30 years is very possible.

 

[RD.]

Weight your fish and weight out the food. List the type of food and state how often you feed. This is information that matters.

You expect members to weigh their fish, and weigh their food?
I'm not about to stress out any of my fish by playing catch and release for anyone on MFK. And only speaking for myself, I don't care what others feed their fish, or how much. This was a general conversation regarding feeding, not a classroom experiment.


Feeding fish is part art, and part science, and can and will vary greatly depending on the species, the life stage of that species, the individual fish itself, and based on it's day to day energy level. That could vary based on the temp of the tank water, tank mates, sexual activity (or not?) as well as the ME (kcal/kg) of each type, brand or formula of food, etc-etc-etc. Way too many variables to attempt to make any real sense from on a public forum. That's where experience comes into play.

I would hope that those who have many years of experience in feeding fish, know from experience generally how much a fish requires for normal growth and daily metabolic function, and the difference between that, and excess.

The reason that the OP started this thread was due to the many examples of obese cichlids that had been, and were being posted, and the constant talk among members about *power feeding*. I still read where people are feeding and promoting high protein diets (over 50%) for fish classified as omnivores, and people feeding pellet sizes that are far too large for the fish they are keeping. These are classic rookie mistakes, made by folks that are obviously inexperienced in feeding fish. Is it possible that there are those with many years in the hobby that do this, and overfeed their fish? Yup.

 

[neutrino]

It's much simpler than weights and measures for me. There's too many variables-- temperature, tank size, different food formulations, hundreds of different species with different growth rates and activity levels to name a few-- to get that technical about it, and for me there's no need. Experience has taught me amounts to feed without measuring out weights. If I was doing a lab study, fine, otherwise no need for it in feeding my own fish. But that's a matter of approach, someone else might want to approach it more technically, not how I do it.

Beyond some basics, like fry and growing fish needing more food than adults or older fish, or very active fish burning more calories than calmer fish, the bottom line for me is based on body profile and I simply adjust accordingly. Normal body profile varies by species but in general I try to keep most fish with reasonably flat bellies, not rounded out bellies. Also, many cichlid species are "laterally compressed" in body profile, if you know what they're supposed to look like or what you want them to look like you can adjust feed to get there ime. Paying attention to that feedback-- if my fish started getting too round I'd cut them back, if too skinny I'd feed a little more-- basically taught me how much to feed over the years.

Used to breed a lot of Malawi cichlids, not uncommon to get an individual overly aggressive eater every so often, which can lead to bloat. When I saw this I'd separate the fish and essentially put it on a diet, some you could do this a couple of times and they'd stop being such pigs, others not, so they might have to live in a different tank where I could better control how much they got to eat.

As far as examples of fish living longer than ten years, there are more than I've kept track of. I currently have 11.5 year old cyphotilapia kapampa in one tank and a 14 year old L260 pleco in another. Two, three years ago I had a rotkeil sev finally die at about 15 years old. Couldn't say how many haps and peacocks I've had reach ten or more years, considering I kept and raised hundreds of them.

 

[philipraposo1982]

I totally get where your coming from. And that's incredible to have fish live with you for so long. I am working towards that for myself.

As far as this discussion goes I think it's important to be able to put numbers on it.

But yeah, in day to day life and how we feed our fish it's not about specifically measuring foods. Overfeeding and mean so many things to many different people. It's just hard to talk about it without some form of constant.

 

[RD.]

That's the point, there is no constant. I could have the same species, same sex, same size, but my fish swims laps all day, while the fish in the next tank a town over spends most of its time sitting behind a log. Energy (feed) levels will obviously not be near the same.

if you know what they're supposed to look like or what you want them to look like you can adjust feed to get there ime

Exactly. I remember when a friend of mine came back from working for the late Stuart Grant on Lake Malawi, he was shocked at how "small" most of the different species of cichlids were in the wild, compared to the same species swimming in his own tanks. It wasn't until then that he realized he had been feeding too much over the years, way too much.

 

[LloydGross]

Feeding your fish as much as they will eat in x amount of seconds sounds great but that doesn't account for aggressive eaters and dominance issues. I feed 4 times the size of the fishes eye once a day

 

[philipraposo1982]

Why are we comparing to wild animals anyhow?

In the home aquaria we are providing in some cases better care and diet compared to wild counterparts. In the wild they are not privileged to eating all the time. But doesn't mean that it's not good to heavy a steady source of quality food.

I mean humans like the jungle (tribes) and eat alot less then we do. Many of us still eat plenty and workout and are healthy. But by the standards of our tribal people we eat many times more food then they do.

 

[RD.]

We compare to wild specimens, as healthy vibrant wild specimens should be considered the standard of excellence. In the wild one doesn't see obese cichlids, with livers covered in yellow waxy fat. Better care & diet shouldn't equate to grotesque specimens that barely resemble what one would typically find in nature. I think that logic would be a rather hard sell to most serious hobbyists.