Forget the nitrates LOOK AT THAT STOCK!!! You clearly aren't a rookie.
I haven't check nitrates in years. Not because I don't care, because I'm too lazy to shake that damn bottle for 5 minutes to get an accurate reading!!! LMAO
I think there are other rare species that are sensitive to nitrates. When rays were still new and exotic, I think the assumption was that they had to be sensitive to nitrates because they are so sensitive to ammonia. Maybe it's possible that they are ultra sensitive to ammonia and extremely resilient to nitrates.
This has been discussed here for years with the smoking analogy, and I feel that is the most accurate lens to view it through.
i'm lazy too, i usually only test intensively after a major setup change or new fish are added.
rays aint the only ones that are fine with relatively high nitrates though, although rays are most oftenly used as a bechmark because of how senstive they are to bad water parameters. but in my book that applies to ammonia/nitrites, not nitrates. i, and others, have had tons of other fish species thrive in 3 digits nitrates. i know others with 300-400ish, i keep mine below 200 cause that's the more realistic figure for me with 2 WC a week... no issues with discus or even wild caught altums. i guess when your tap water already has detectable nitrites/nitrates, and has high chloramine which just releases ammonia (which ultimately becomes nitrates) after anti chlorine, nitrates always remain high and we make do with it. i did try with RO and denitrators, but just gave up one fine day and havent seen no difference with the fish ever since.
with smokers u actually have a huge range of data which proves how many of the chemicals are carcinogenic, and the number of ppl getting cancer due to smoking is undeniable (i'm a smoker myself at any rate lol). so if we're comparing nitrates to smoking, i would expect to see some glaring proof of fish getting sick or dying... which surprisingly enough i havent seen, both personally and from the many fish enthusiasts i know. all i see is ppl blaming anything above 50 nitrates as the cause of fish death overnight, which i cant believe at all cause i would have hundreds of mortalities by now if that were the case.
I don't have rays, I had tanks for years without water changes, back when I was 10 years old In 1984.
My tanks also smelled, and the water was yellow.
i guess we've all been there and done that. god knows i'll still be doing the same if it wasnt for the internet lol.
I know in oscar keeping world, 180ppm nitrates will lead to hole in the head and maybe a 4yr lifespan at best. Many other fish will develop dropsy and various fin rot issues with that level as well.
please do provide links to show that HIH, dropsy, fin rot etc are directly caused by 180ppm nitrates. i don't keep oscars anymore, but i guarentee u at the period of my oscar keeping i was 100% clueless on what water parameters are, and guaging by my once a month WC back then i highly doubt it'll have been lower than a couple of hundreds. i've asked friends with massively overstocked tanks to check their nitrates after years of running (they never did check for nitrates ever), and... u know the result.
The most glaring contradiction to your statement is none of my fish have fallen sick, let alone get to the stage of dropsy. i don't use UV, no salt for preventive measure, not even melafix when there's huge open wounds. by your reasoning my fish would be a sickly mottley bunch by now, but in reality it's quite the opposite?
i think i sound like a broken record by now harping over the same points repeatedly. point is i've read up on all the dangers and potential side effects of nitrates over the years, and i'm simply questioning how high is high, and why are my fish alive and kicking and apparantly more problem free than those with <40 nitrates?
The one thing I can think of, about high nitrates is the amount of silicate, phosphate, phosphorus, sulfate, and similar compounds that lead to, bacteria blooms, diatomaceous growths, and weird slime algae stuff.
Crazy little blooms of hydra, and water conditions that convince daphnia to go dormant.
no bacterial or algae blooms for me, at times i get clear green water which i like and would love to make it a permanent thing but it goes away with the WC. weird slime like growth on the glass /tank surface i do get if i dont clean them for more than 2 weeks. i always thought they were a bacterial film and never got any harm outta it apart from being unsightly so i just use a sponge on a stick n clean that crap once a month.
