LARGE sharks and aquarists

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
I personally think the fault lies in both the sellers and the buyers. The sellers should be responsible enough to not sell to people if they the customer doesn't have the equipment to properly care for the animal. At the same time the seller doesn't always know the buyers capablity so people also need to research before they purchase pets. You should know what your getting into before you buy it.
 
Personal responsibility is a primary concern. As we have discussed, it is still a business and will continue to be treated as such. I'm really not the eco-terrorist hippie that my father is but, the American slaughterhouse is a prime example. No we're not keeping these animals for life, but as the revenue increases production increases and something of a loss of humanity kicks in. That's what allows someone to be able to do that sort of a job. Jesus I am turning into my father...

Education is key, no questions. In my early fish keeping I succumbed to the same fallacies that most of us do. Start small, overbuy, overstock, try to find a bigger tank fast and lose a lot of fish on the way. It's unfortunate but for me that proved to be the best education. By the time I came around to trying monsters, I had all of that previous knowledge which led me to the conclusion that I couldn't afford it. We've all done something similar at some point, though our mistakes are on the lives of our critters we still learn and drive the business.

There is something I've found in keeping monsters and conversing with other mfkers. I'll put this into the context that I've found it. We truly are the next step/evolution? of fishkeeping. All of the best innovation I've found from filtering through custom jobs has been here. What it is we will eventually provide is the next generation of not only fish, but of fish keeper. Was it the acanth that had a shipping halt recently out of Australia? Name might be off but my lfs reflected this in a severe price hike on the coral that they could no longer get. We're talking $40 to $600 overnight. However, they have a local guy who has been keeping various reefs in his 40+ tanks for the past two decades. His growth rates are so high and his process so refined that he brings frags of this coral in every three months. Not a bad deal, considering they can't get the coral from their supplier anymore. What we will eventually become is the last threshold of conservation for these things. I don't know about you guys but that leaves me jazzed. Some of us are so good that we have flourishing propogation of our beasts within the aquarium. That's why (I'm convinced) the arapaima was put back on the market. Hobbyist conservation. I'm hoping we'll see that with the asian arro's too. My god my father is coming through today.

On the other hand, there is a very simple way to reduce the amount of amatuer loss. I've seen coral banded shark eggs at my lfs for $15. If we really want to sift out the middle-men, raise that price. I've actually considered getting the shark egg. Had it been two years ago I might have purchased it. To the unknowing hobbyist $15 is a mistake that is very easy to compensate. If the mistake cost $200, $400 or even $600 bucks then we'd seriously rethink it. I came to that conclusion (by the way) doing a research project for the biology section of my Oceanography class. I found a supplier out of Perth who had baby hammerhead sharks. All I had to provide was a permit, a federally approved 10,000 gallon tank and $4500 for the shark. If not for the permit, tank requirements or cash I might have purchased. (HA!) Maybe therein is the answer.

It's always great to see an lfs take responsibility. My guys are similar in their practice. They (to make a short story even longer) know me and my tank so well that I can't even look at their display fish without my stock coming into question. Just down the street though, we have a shop that will sell a fish straight from the distributor without acclimation or quarantine time. Sometimes the lfs needs to be regulated as well as us.

And finally, thanks. I try to be well worded. (Look at that ego grow!!!)

Swim on!
 
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249706
"WHATS WRONG WITH MY SHARK"

Read that thread i posted, to test responses. In a 24 hour period, with such a grossly inhumane act "supposedly" being perpetrated, no one got nasty or flame-atory. But when someone has the recommended minimum tank size and not the mandatory required tank size as per expert of the day, everyone joins in to flame the @#$#@ out of said noobie.

Whats wrong with you people!? I dont get it.
 
It's an interesting social experiment, that's for sure. You've certainly raised some good points.

At this point though, and very respectively, scale it back a bit. Personal bias will play a huge role in what advice is offered and how. I really would hate to see a great discussion boil down to what it is we're trying not to do.

Please don't by any means think I'm trying to belittle or come down on you. You are passionate, and we all must be. Continuation as is will begin to damage credibility and case though.
 
Love the Tessalata in your avatar - by far and away one of my favorite eels. I have two Fimbriated eels in my 265 gallon tank in the living room, which are mildly similar in appearance, but nowhere near that manner of disposition. I'm planning on putting a tessie in my big shark tank. But that's going off on a tangent. And yes, I'm new to sharks.

You all make valid points in regards to supply/demand for our favorite pets. It is a shame that there are so many disreputable LFS out there that will sell whatever to whomever. After quite a search, I've been VERY fortunate to find a very well regarded store near me - I knew I was in the right place when I inquired after the two blacktips for sale, and their first question was, "Do you have at least a 2000 gallon tank right now? And do you have plans for an even larger tank? If not, don't even bother asking further - we won't sell them to you." And once I pointed out that I had both, they've been wonerful. They're selection is amazing, and the fish all look healthy. Likewise, there are two LFS that have various types of sharks who are more than happy to sell smoothhounds and claim they'll be happy in 150 gallon tanks for their lives.

Unfortunately, people will continue to purchase exotic pets, and there will always be a supplier for any desire. The best solution is that of education - it's our responsibility to help novice keepers, and not admonish even foolish keepers. There are inevitably going to be people who desperately want to keep a shark in a small tank. Odds are good that they've been fed tripe by their LFS, and it's much easier (and rightly so, generally) to believe a person with whom you can talk in person, rather than a faceless opinion behind a keyboard. As such, we can't immediately call a keeper an idiot or a "noob" (I abhor that term, it's so condescending) when they question information found here.

Lastly, well worded responses featuring legible spelling and grammar are always a huge help, and a definite sign of intelligent replies. No matter the character of a reply, if I have to take out an internet to english dictionary to understand what's being said, I don't take it seriously.

T-3 weeks til my tank is ready.
 
This thread has come a long way. And so have we. I can honestly say now that with this site and my own readings, that reality needs to come into play, and for a while, I was the type who would ignore the facts, just to get their hands on a particular fish, or just would go to the LFS to buy something for its looks.

This also reminds me of when I was walking through a walmart and a parent and their child were buying a tank for a goldfish (go figure), and they stated that the 1.5 gallon table-top tank, was "too much water to change"......

I honestly think that the conscientious aquarist will not ignore all warnings given to him/her when it comes to the husbandry of a species of fish. Even if one post is off from what everyone else says, it should be taken into account. Even if that information is not what that person wants to hear.

Again, Realism.....

Nitro
 
HAHAHA... 1.5 gallon is too much water to change... I'd bet I evaporate that much everyday.
 
LOL, funny story about evap. Did some math yesterday on our ray holding pool. 1" loss is 782 gallons.... we lost 3" in a day to evap. That's 2,346 gallons a day to replace with freshwater.
 
I tend to agree that the responibility lays with both the buyer & the seller.

Many LFS are more than happy to sell the customer what every they want, without reguard of if the aquarist can care for the fish. Some LFS will go as far as to tell the customer that the fish will only grow as big as the tank it's kept in. Which is a major load of crap.
The truth about most LFS - is that most really don't know that much about sharks or rays. And those that do often quote inaccurate & outdated sources like "Aquarium Sharks & Rays". So it's really not a good idea for the private aquarist to trust the information given by even the best LFS, on keeping sharks or rays.

At the same time - If a private aquarist is true interested in keeping sharks or rays - tend they should do as much research as possible before getting one. Which means - buy books, get magazine articles, and contact private aquarists (thru forums, like this one) whom have already kept and have experience in keeping sharks. NEVER buy a Shark or ray on impulse. And NEVER start with species that get large (like Nurses or large Wobbie) or that are very active (like the requiems).

The most common complaint from private aquarists - just getting into sharks - is I want a Shark that looks like a Shark(i.e. a requiem shark). Which is the absolutely wrong approach to keeping a shark. IT should never be about what you want - but instead about what you can safely keep for it's life. It okay to dream about keeping a requiem shark, but you should also be practical enough to figure out if it's realistically possible. And if it's not what are your alternatives.

I've talked with many private aquarists whom simply love their eppies, bamboos, coral cats or horn sharks. Which is the way it should be. Most large or active species of sharks(available to private aquarists) aren't generally suited for most private aquarists. But they doesn't mean that they can't be kept by private aquarists, if the private aquarist has the space and financial means to do so.
 
Zoodiver;3629783; said:
LOL, funny story about evap. Did some math yesterday on our ray holding pool. 1" loss is 782 gallons.... we lost 3" in a day to evap. That's 2,346 gallons a day to replace with freshwater.
Click to expand...


Jeebus - that's 1.6 gallons per MINUTE.
 
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