Laws, Ethics and the future of our hobby

[teleost]

In the time I've spent on this forum I've seen some bad stuff.

Taking wild natural trout/salmon from western coastal waters.

Taking almost every single kind of sportfish with illegal devices.

Sales of fish without proper permits (illegal sales).

Keeping of fish that have no business being taken from the wild (Sturgeon and paddlefish for instance).

Taking sportfish way under legal limits to only be housed in tanks 1/10 the size needed for reasonable care.

Countess instances of illegal release of fish.

I'm sure I've missed a few.

Each time ethics or law is brought up, many here simply ridicule those pointing out the failure to recognize the law. In the case of ethics it's actually much worse since some feel justified in doing anything they want within the law and pay no attention to the practical care of the fish or responsible stewardship of natural waters.

It's sad that we simply excuse illegal behavior from kids since this is exactly the time in development to allow kids to asses the importance of law and order from personal experience and not having Mom and Dad simply yell at them. I understand what being a kid is all about...I was a kid once. I never found a place where the rule makers excused my illegal behavior. This sets a very bad example for young impressionable minds and I beg the officials to understand this can only lead to a general degradation of the hobby and respect for the law in general.

This is a public forum and the various Departments of Natural Resources read this and other forums. Plain and simple if enough guys break the law and have 10:1 support for breaking the laws, it won't be long before our hobby is gone for good. I'd like my grandchildren to have as much fun keeping native fish as I do. Please don't ruin it for them and future generations.

I beg the younger members to look up their state regulations for taking Native fish. I don't yet know of a single state that does not publish a copy of the rules and regulations online. If you can read this, you can take the time to read your state's rules.

I guess I'm in the troll category along with the others that recognize the importance of the law and following it.

 

[ewurm]

No teleost, you're wrong. This site supports following the law. What it does not support is ridiculing, insulting, and demeaning people who are otherwise ignorant of said laws and/or ethics. And what puts you in the troll category is the fact that you only show up to belittle, demean and insult people and this board. If you and your friends decided to choose your words in "helping" people who don't know better a little more wisely, you might find the board to be a little more accepting of the knowledge you bring to the table.

 

[sharkaddict]

I agree with you 100% however, I dont think that people frown on others for pointing things out, its just how it is presented to them. There have been many posts on here of others bashing others without finding out the complete story first. I think constructive criticism is ok, as long as it is done in a positive manner. On the other hand if there is a member on here constantly posting about illegal activities, then they should no longer be allowed as a member.

 

[teleost]

I'm not saying the site supports law breaking. I don't think the site moderators know the laws on Natives to be honest. If they do, they indeed choose not enlighten the members of the law. So which is it?

Are you suggesting that I ridicule, insult or demean members?????????
I think not and thanks for your particularly sharp and thoughtless post here since you decide to pick on my thread (and myself) instead of taking others to task. If you'd just take this amount of time to guide the youngsters here, this could be a different site.

The guys here have heard us politely discuss laws and ethics. It's up to moderation to set them straight. They see lots of peers support illegal activity and a few follow the law with NO GUIDANCE from moderators to FOLLOW THE LAW.

If you think the recent case doesn't know it's illegal to take game/sport fish with nets then you either don't pat attention around here or simply don't care.

My knowledge means squat to many members here and I'm fine with that. This is the whole point to my topic. I'm just one cog in the works along with all other general membership. This forum needs serious moderation. Preferably someone that cares about native fish in the wild as well as in the home aquaria.

 

[ewurm]

I too agree with teleost, and polypterus, and drewish. They stop in to make valid points to people who who are ignorant of or otherwise abuse the laws and ethics of native fishkeeping and collecting. The abrasive manner with which they disseminate this information is what chaps my ass.

 

[Oddball]

It's not trollish behavior to post what needs to be said as a reminder to all who partake in hobbies that have a direct effect on natural resources. There will always be naysayers to these reminders of our responsibilities to both the future of our hobby and to maintaining proper balances in the wild. The only change I would make is to not single out this specific forum. You'll find the same opinions and behaviors on every fish board. But, stick to your guns. These reminders are appreciated.

 

[ewurm]

I'm not saying the site supports law breaking. I don't think the site moderators know the laws on Natives to be honest. If they do, they indeed choose not enlighten the members of the law. So which is it?

Are you suggesting that I ridicule, insult or demean members?????????
I think not and thanks for your particularly sharp and thoughtless post here since you decide to pick on my thread (and myself) instead of taking others to task. If you'd just take this amount of time to guide the youngsters here, this could be a different site.

The guys here have heard us politely discuss laws and ethics. It's up to moderation to set them straight. They see lots of peers support illegal activity and a few follow the law with NO GUIDANCE from moderators to FOLLOW THE LAW.

If you think the recent case doesn't know it's illegal to take game/sport fish with nets then you either don't pat attention around here or simply don't care.

My knowledge means squat to many members here and I'm fine with that. This is the whole point to my topic. I'm just one cog in the works along with all other general membership. This forum needs serious moderation. Preferably someone that cares about native fish in the wild as well as in the home aquaria.

No moderator stopped into the thread you are referring to to say that it is OK to take gamefish with a net. The only thing that was mentioned was the attitude problem by the people who did mention it.

This is what pisses me off: People could have learned from this post, but instead it was this garbage:

Who cares??? it is a bunch of Young of the year sunfish....What are you even bothering to collect them for??? Your not going to ID them to species obviously.

If your peeing you pants thinking this is a good find I'm worried about you....They are everywhere this time of year.

I guess if it is your first time you might get a premature orgasm or something but you will learn in time, Fall means thousands of little sunfish everywhere.

 

[teleost]

No moderator stopped into the thread you are referring to to say that it is OK to take gamefish with a net. The only thing that was mentioned was the attitude problem by the people who did mention it.

Again, I'm not saying the forum supports illegal activity; nor does it do anything to correct it. This is what chaps my rear end.

I'll not defend the coarse word dispensed upon the unsuspecting member but I'll certainly not take offense to it either simply due to the wild west attitude here.

Again....nothing a strong moderator can't fix. I believe the offending person would be one of the better members here if stern moderation were enforced and I'm not kidding. A complete turnaround would be observed by all. This is a helpful individual on other forums with a wealth of knowledge. He also happen to have a problem with disease, illegal capture and non native introductions. I can tell you this chaps his rear end and lets everyone know.

 

[sharkaddict]

Are you suggesting that I ridicule, insult or demean members?????????
I think not and thanks for your particularly sharp and thoughtless post here since you decide to pick on my thread (and myself) instead of taking others to task. If you'd just take this amount of time to guide the youngsters here, this could be a different site.

What this directed towards me?

 

[ewurm]

Again, I'm not saying the forum supports illegal activity; nor does it do anything to correct it. This is what chaps my rear end.

I'll not defend the coarse word dispensed upon the unsuspecting member but I'll certainly not take offense to it either simply due to the wild west attitude here.

Again....nothing a strong moderator can't fix. I believe the offending person would be one of the better members here if stern moderation were enforced and I'm not kidding. A complete turnaround would be observed by all. This is a helpful individual on other forums with a wealth of knowledge. He also happen to have a problem with disease, illegal capture and non native introductions. I can tell you this chaps his rear end and lets everyone know.

That individual you speak of would probably be a moderator here if he chose his words with a little more tact. He chooses not to. Also, I was the first mod to notice that thread, and the first thing I noticed that stood out to me, was that BS comment. So it isn't that we support, or allow things like that to go unchecked. We don't have the manpower to police every thread, and we count on members to educate other members as well. That doesn't include flaming a kid with a tank full of sunfish. I welcome your knowledge of natives and the laws which are far greater than mine. That also goes for Polypterus and Drewish too. Try and be civil. No one has ever learned a thing from someone they couldn't respect, and I have never respected anyone who talked down to me.