massive enclosure for burmese and boa

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synapse989

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Sep 25, 2006
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Midland, Michigan
So I posted before about my reptile rescue.. I decided these two big snakes deserved appropriate housing... I have enough room and some of it was unused, so we're making an L-shaped massive enclosure for the big snakes to grow in. I'm uploading to photobucket.. here are links to the work in progress..

This is one of the two large double paned glass doors.. they weigh like 200lbs each.. ..I like recycling.. ;-)

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f70/alliancemetalart/DSC00600.jpg

Here's a photo of the rescued Burmese.."Lucky" ..poor little guy.. just a baby.. only around 5 feet long right now.

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f70/alliancemetalart/DSC00603.jpg

my friend Greg laying out some of the boards for the foundation..

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f70/alliancemetalart/DSC00601.jpg

here's where we are now..

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f70/alliancemetalart/DSC00604.jpg

each enclosure is getting a "pond" so they can swim around, and a big hide box (cave) on the other end.. I have some lights being donated, and I have lots of fluorescent fixtures that I can replace the bulbs with the proper reptile lights.. I have some heating elements that we're going to build into the structure.. numerous access doors.. so far so good!
 
by the way.. this IS a reptile rescue! If you have any things you'd like to donate it will be greatly appreciated.. ..I'm speaking for the reptiles..
 
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yeah those pics are just of the foundation... it's going to be around 7.5 feet tall in total.. we're estimating the total gallons of the entire enclosure at 3350 gallons.. ..roughly..

two enclosures in one big unit.
 
hehe if my math is right we'll have just over 3/4ths of a million cubic inches. LOL.
 
I have several boas, and I'm gonna say it will NOT use that much space. Most people recommend a 4x8 cage for a burmese, and a guideline to go by for boas is 1/2 as long as the snake and 1/3 as wide as the snake is long. Burms tend to be very lethargic snakes, and don't move much as adults. I took care of a burm that lived in a cage roughly 6x8 feet (kind of an odd shape to it, not quite square), and it never left one corner, except to get water, and occasionally to stretch out after it ate a big meal. Since your boa will most likely not even hit 10 feet(I'm guessing it's a Colombian, since you didn't specify otherwise- expect it to get around 8' if that's the case), a cage 6' long and 3' wide is more than large enough.

My boas are more active, but they won't use much height. My boas are in cages 18" tall, and it's more than enough space for them. Every once in a while I'll find one of them climbing a branch in the cage, but it's rare. These snakes will get large enough that they simply won't care about climbing- it takes more effort than it's worth. Making the cage taller may sound nice, but what it translates into is wasted electricity. It just costs more to keep the cage warm if it's taller than needed. Many people even make boa cages as short as 12", although I think that's a little extreme. 18 works perfect for me- it's more room than my boas need, and gives me a great amount of space to move around in the cage.

I can't really tell exactly how the cage is being set up- are they two separate enclosures, or one large enclosure to house the snakes together? Is it two levels of cage, with one stacked on top of the other, or is it divided in the middle somehow?

It's awesome to see a nice enclosure, and it's great to see it way bigger than necessary, but I do have to question something: If you're running a reptile rescue, wouldn't it make more sense to be able to house more animals efficiently than only a couple animals inefficiently? Generally a pet-quality display and a rescue's cage are two different things. And having a couple adopted snakes doesn't really make you a rescue. Be careful about how you word things when you're running an animal rescue, it's very easy to run into trouble because of it.


And finally, I'm curious what you mean by
I have some lights being donated, and I have lots of fluorescent fixtures that I can replace the bulbs with the proper reptile lights..
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There's no such thing as a "proper reptile light" for snakes. They don't need UVB at all, and UVB lights don't work past 12", anyway. If you're building a cage that tall, putting in a UVB light is just throwing money away no matter what's in it. With a boa and a burm, it's completely unnecessary. They need enough light for you to see them properly, and that's really it.

For a cage that size heat lamps are going to be pretty pointless. Heat rises, so you'd have to put several REALLY high wattage bulbs in there to be able to keep the snakes warm enough. Otherwise, you'd have to put the bulbs down low to the floor of the cage, and at that point, the snakes will be able to come into contact with them and WILL end up with burns because of it. You could try heat tape, but I'm guessing it's going to be a plywood bottom, and the tape won't heat through the bottom very well.
Look into Radiant Heat Panels- a lot of people REALLY like those. They only get warm to the touch, and heat an enclosure very well. They're expensive, but extremely energy efficient, and safe. I've actually heard of people heating whole rooms in their houses with these things, and supposedly they pay for themselves really quickly.
For snakes that size you could also look at Kane heat mats. They're big red mats used for livestock. Those ones are suitable to put completely inside the enclosure, compared to other heating sources.


Good luck with everything. Like i said, it really is nice to see a quality display cage being built. Keep us updated with pics & info, please!
 
....heat rises? wow man.. THANK YOU. ..from the last paragraph you wrote.. wow. I'm blown away your spectrum of knowledge. It was like.. years of education and experience just suddenly made sense to me!

Thanks, but no thanks.. we planned this thing out before we even started looking for wood. I'll take your advice how how to do it half-assed though.. ..and on how to guess that this is being done with no budget and in a small space..

Building - 4235 sq.ft. .. Space alloted for reptile rescue - 1280 sq.ft.

Heat Source for building - Universal Grain Burner (closed system) w/ forced air unit and 450,000 BTU heat exchanger.

I'm insulating the enclosure.. completely. blown cellulose in the foundation along with bead board and dow foam.

In the winter, when it was 20 degrees outside, it was 81 in here and the big garage doors in the shop area had to be opened because it was too hot. People were working in t-shirts and sweating their asses off. So don't make silly dumb assumptions when you have NO idea what you're talking about..

..and that goes for your crack about lighting.. do some research.. Snakes *REQUIRE* full spectrum lighting to properly metabolize certain vitamins and minerals.

Also.. it's a myth that they're more comfortable in a small enclosure... It's my guess that the person who started that dumb idea spent some time in prison, or just never left their bedroom. I have an acre.. I let my boa cruise around the yard.. and I spent an hour or more following him from one side of the yard to the other...

but yeah they don't need more than 32 sq ft to cruise in.. with a low ceiling.. that's a horrible concept. I don't believe it.
 
rnocera, you've been :owned:
looks like synapse989, and crew knows what they are doing...
silly for you to doubt the rescue aspect, did you even view the images?

synapse989, keep up the good work, it's misinformation like rnocera quoted, that causes the need for rescue in the first place...all too often pet owners have no idea what they are in for when the pet matures.
 
I don't appreciate the attitude. I'm speaking from 17 years of experience keeping reptiles, and personal experience with both Burmese pythons and boa constrictors. I speak from breeding several species of reptiles, with an entire room of my house dedicated to my reptiles. I speak of 18 snakes currently in my collection, experience working in a small zoo where I was responsible for the lives of hundreds of exotics. Zennzzo, I quoted no misinformation; do a little research yourself to show me where I was wrong. And it's silly for me to doubt the rescue aspect? Thousands of people claim to run "rescues" for animals that they "adopt." More often than not it's a scam where people are looking for someone else to pay for their own pets. Sorry, yes, I'm a a little uptight about it. Someone comes on the forum asking for donations for his rescue and doesn't even tell us what the rescue is called? And his pictures show what appears to be an unfinished basement with exposed wiring; bare, cracked cement floors; and junk piled around a couple of TVs. How do his pictures support that he's running a rescue? I could show you pictures of my breeding operation; they would look much more professional than his pics do. I wasn't trying to insult him. If he's actually running a reptile rescue, great. We need them. But go back up and look at what he wrote. He could barely form a complete sentence, posted pictures of junk piled everywhere, and asked people to send him free stuff without ever saying the name of the organization he's running, or even attaching his name to the post. After being cursed at, I look at previous things he's written to see what else he's said about his rescue and what I find is a post from 9/2 saying he has 4 snakes and another post from 9/4 saying
ok so I've dedicated a section of my shop, roughly 600 sq ft for the reptile rescue.. I'm going to build an L-shaped double enclosure for the boa and the burmese.. I have an area taped out.. we're going to start building tomorrow.
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Somewhere between yesterday and today the 600 square feet he dedicated became 1280 (when he tried to sound professional?).

Ok, heating, you've got under control. I heat my snake room to 82 degrees, as well. However, for someone who mentions two snakes in a post and two snakes in his signature, heating a whole room isn't generally the energy efficient way to go about it. Many people who build cages never think about how they're going to heat it until after it's finished. Sorry for making a suggestion that was trying to save you money.

And although you've got heating under control, I am curious- why are you insulating the cage so well if the heat source is outside the cage? Are you trying to keep it cooler than the room around it? Water evaporating from the "pond" alone will be enough to cool that cage down a few degrees, and the insulation will keep heat from coming in.

Find me a couple valid sources that tell me snakes need full spectrum lighting to properly metabolize certain vitamins and minerals. Note, I said VALID source, not a company trying to sell you the light. Find me a VALID source that says a standard fluorescent UVB light will reach more than 12" away from the light source. Heck, even just do a google search for it; pet stores and geocities sites tell you your snakes need full spectrum lighting. Do a little bit of reading and show off your "education" you boast of. (Just to help you out, here's a link to an anapsid.org article, a valid source saying they DON'T need it, in addition to every single book I've ever read on the subject.) While you're at it, why don't you tell me how far away from the animal you're supposed to put your UVB light? I already pointed out that standard fluorescent UVB bulbs don't emit UVB further than 12", and your response was to bash me and call me an idiot because I didn't even know they need it.

In my first post I said from first hand experience that I feel the cage is larger than is necessary. I didn't say you shouldn't do it, just that it's larger than is necessary. I gave the standard rule of thumb printed in most books I've read about snakes (1/2 the length, 1/3 the width), and talked about the adult size for a boa. I have three boa constrictors in my house now, and told you that I don't see them using vertical space very often. I also mentioned the two Burmese pythons I cared for, and said exactly what they did. His response was to say that he doesn't believe it. He supplies no personal experience other than telling us he lets his boa constrictor crawl around in the grass outside. Yes, well, if I put one of my fish in a pond outside it would swim around; does that mean it needs a whole pond, or is my aquarium large enough? There's a difference between an animal being loose in the wild, and being contained in a cage.

And finally, I said that I feel the cage is larger than necessary, but I supported him building it. If you go back and look at it, I said it's nice to see someone building a decent display cage. So thank you for bashing me and cursing at me. I really appreciate it!
 
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