hamato_yoshii;2842632; said:
They look terrible. I even dropped Stuckey after he hit the apparent "wall". They need some serious help right now.
****MFK's Official '08-'09 NBA Discussion Thread****
- Thread starter bigspizz
- Start date
They look terrible. I even dropped Stuckey after he hit the apparent "wall". They need some serious help right now.
pdbrady;2843129; said:
they looked pretty all right last night against superboy ( sorry dwight the 45pts.shaq dropped, proved he's still superman) ....
deangelo;2844876; said:
They did look better......without Iverson. Like I said when they made the trade, it was pointless. Iverson just demands the ball too much. However, I feel Orlando lost that game themselves. Alston probably had his worst game since coming over. They shot a terrible percentage from 3 pt range......then instead of dropping it to Howard, they continue to shoot and miss from long distance. If you notice, when they win, it's because they run their plays through Howard. When he starts killing people, doubles come, leaving guys open all over the court. I don't know why they veer from that proven path.
Shaq had a big game, but I don't think he's still holding the crown. He doesn't have the dominance he use to, and that Howard does. He's just still big, but nowhere near as athletic. Actually he was never as athletic as Howard is right now. Besides, Howard just scored 45 like a week ago, along with 19 boards, 8 blocks, and even shot better from the line than the field.
howard is good but he is no shaq, athletic as he is he wont be as dominant as shaq was in his prime..7'2" 350 lb. diesel
howard scored 47 sure but shaq did it at 37, and a young shaq was among the top three in scoring year in and year out, howards ave. is like 20th in the league
howard scored 47 sure but shaq did it at 37, and a young shaq was among the top three in scoring year in and year out, howards ave. is like 20th in the league
deangelo;2849946; said:
Sure, Shaq in his prime was the most dominant big man to ever play (and of course still has it), but Howard is still a kid. There's a big difference in team makeup between Shaq having a high average, and Howard not. Turkoglu, Nelson, and Lewis all take a lot of shots. If they ran the ball through Howard like every team has with Shaq, he would be among the league leaders in scoring, guaranteed. Shaq took about 20 shots a game in those years. Howard in his short carrer averages right at 11. Then there's rebounding. Shaq has never averaged 14, Howard's doing it for the second straight year. Howard's a better ft shooter, so that helps, and he's only getting better. It's a debate that could go on forever. We'll see what Howard's future has for him. Oh, and I'm pretty sure Shaq never weighed 350.....315 was his Diesel size
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pdbrady;2850994; said:Sure, Shaq in his prime was the most dominant big man to ever play (and of course still has it), but Howard is still a kid. There's a big difference in team makeup between Shaq having a high average, and Howard not. Turkoglu, Nelson, and Lewis all take a lot of shots. If they ran the ball through Howard like every team has with Shaq, he would be among the league leaders in scoring, guaranteed. Shaq took about 20 shots a game in those years. Howard in his short carrer averages right at 11. Then there's rebounding. Shaq has never averaged 14, Howard's doing it for the second straight year. Howard's a better ft shooter, so that helps, and he's only getting better. It's a debate that could go on forever. We'll see what Howard's future has for him. Oh, and I'm pretty sure Shaq never weighed 350.....315 was his Diesel size
you forget shaq had kobe, wade, penny 3 of the highest scoring guards ever..
shaq even dropped 33 on the lakers today..
the reason that howard doesnt ave. as much as shaq is cause he doesnt have the same post game as the diesel, sure shaq could dunk but he could bank it off the glass, the spin, the jump hook..
thats what howard needs to work on..skills not just dunking, athleticism can only get you so far (e.g dominique wilkins) but fundamentals and skills will always be there even if athleticism is not (e.g duncan)
deangelo;2852591; said:
Shaq only had to share with one of those guys at a time, and with the exception of Wade, we all know there were even disputes in that. Howard has 3 guys around him averaging 17+ppg. 20 spg compared to 11 is a big difference. If Shaq only put up 11, he would've averaged what Howard is now. Howard is vastly improving in those areas, too. His hooks are getting better (l/r hand, sweeping, jump), his range is slowly improving, and that's one thing Shaq never had. I also shy from Shaq being so skilled, but rather just being so huge. Not saying he wasn't skilled, but his mass, and the inability to defend it, is what made him dominant. If you think about the title "Superman" as logically as possible, by relating to the movies, Superman would be someone extremely athletic, rather than just a huge chunk of meat.
If Howard took the 20 shots Shaq did in his prime, do you honestly not think he would average as much as Shaq did? Howard has already set a new standard in rebounds, and he's not even in his prime, so there's no need to question that one. And he will set the standard defensively, mainly with blocks.
If you can't tell, I am very high on Howard lol. He may lack some things now, but will eventually grow into the most dominant big man, topping Shaq. For this debate, looking at right now, I don't see how you can't give the upper hand to Howard. Remember, we're not comparing to either's prime, but rather right now, and whether Shaq should still stand as THE big guy. I don't think he does. Yes he's filling the void nicely right now while others are out, but he can't do it all year. It wasn't long ago he was taking every few games off to rest.
we'll see later, past meets present battle of the big men..hahahaha
at least shaq didnt call howard the "Rupaul" of big men..
at least shaq didnt call howard the "Rupaul" of big men..
deangelo;2858293; said:we'll see later, past meets present battle of the big men..hahahaha
at least shaq didnt call howard the "Rupaul" of big men..
btw, miami v cleveland was very disappointing. i am happy with the o'neal/moon trade, but dropping last night's game was a major blow. darn ref didn't call time-out even though chalmers was yelling for it in his face, and that resulted in a turnover and a three-point play. Plus #$%* varejao is the king of flop. makes me ashamed of being brasilian
deangelo;2858293; said:we'll see later, past meets present battle of the big men..hahahaha
at least shaq didnt call howard the "Rupaul" of big men..
lol I just read that. As funny as it is, that's just cold. Especially since it (Shaq 3 sec) has come up in the past. The Shaq/Howard matchup should be a good one. It's this week I think...?
Onion01;2858920; said:btw, miami v cleveland was very disappointing. i am happy with the o'neal/moon trade, but dropping last night's game was a major blow. darn ref didn't call time-out even though chalmers was yelling for it in his face, and that resulted in a turnover and a three-point play. Plus #$%* varejao is the king of flop. makes me ashamed of being brasilian
I didn't see any of that game, but I totally agree about Varejao. He belongs in San Antonio.
